Jordan Skelton P1 - The Geordie Cesc Fabregas? Injuries, Mental Health & Coming Back Stronger for One Knoxville! - E9

One Knoxville captain Jordan Skelton joins the boys in the Back Stick studio this week! In a lively conversation with Jordan, we share his journey from the UK to the US. From England Schoolboys, to captaining an ambitious USL League One club in One Knox. The discussion covers various themes including the cultural differences in football between the two countries, the challenges of communication due to the thickest geordie accent of all time, and the pressures of professional football. Jordan reflects on his early influences, the competitive landscape of football, and the importance of leadership and communication on the pitch. He also opens up about his struggles with mental health, the impact of injuries, nearly falling out of professional football completely, and his journey to finding joy in the beautiful game again. 

00:00 Intro

01:18 US vs UK Weather

02:47 Geordie Accent in America

07:11 Fabregas, Arsenal & Newcastle

09:13 Different Pathways to Professional Football in the UK

18:31 Leadership on the Pitch

24:50 Different Types of Leaders in Football

25:44 Reflections on Leadership Style

29:30 North Carolina FC Reflections

31:53 College & PDL

35:04 Agent caused 1st Year Pro Contract to Fall Through

37:03 Fighting Injuries in PDL Again

40:39 Overcoming Adversity in Pursuit of Professional Football

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Transcript

Jamil Roberts (00:00)
Hello everyone and welcome to the Back Stick Podcast. I'm Jamil Roberts and I'm joined here as usual by Dom Okus Dom, how are you doing mate?

Jordan Skelton (00:00)
Good night everyone.

Dom Okus (00:09)
Good bro, feeling well back in London right now. It's absolutely freezing. So not buzzing off that, but really looking forward to this conversation. We've got someone here from the UK, so looking forward to just getting into this conversation, man.

Jordan Skelton (00:09)
good for feeding well.

Jamil Roberts (00:15)
You

Yeah, and this is a special episode of the back stick pod because for once All three members in the studio are in the same time zone. We're all in the uk So without further ado, I would like to introduce today's One knoxville captain legend leader. Mr. Jordan Skelton, Skelts How you doing, mate?

Dom Okus (00:33)
folks.

Jordan Skelton (00:40)
I'm

good man, cheers. I'm doing well, I'm very happy to be here lads.

Jamil Roberts (00:51)
Lovely mate and how's it been? Obviously I know you're back up in Newcastle. How's it been seeing the family and that?

Jordan Skelton (00:56)
Yeah, it's been Ledge. We obviously have a fairly long off season over in America. So we have November, December, January kind of our off season, but I get to come home for normally about two weeks or so. So just good to be back seeing the family. It's obviously the only thing you can't really replace when you go over there, isn't it? So it's good to be home.

Jamil Roberts (01:19)
Yeah, absolutely mate and obviously Dom you mentioned it being cold, but I bet up there in the northeast it might be a little bit colder

Dom Okus (01:25)
mate.

Jordan Skelton (01:27)
Absolutely Baltic up here boys, I tell ya. I don't reckon yous two could hack it man.

Jamil Roberts (01:32)
I'll

Dom Okus (01:34)
Yeah, not for me. Not for me.

Jamil Roberts (01:37)
be honest like I mean you're you're you're only just up the road from ours in Knox and we get similar weather Don't we it's nice in that part of Tennessee

Jordan Skelton (01:44)
man.

It's the weather in America is absolutely ledge where I've experienced it because I've been mostly in the South. So I've had a lot of sun a lot of the time. So, you know, it's it's just the problems over there is obviously in the area where you live. can get too hot corners and get like hundred and five and one hundred and turn off.

Jamil Roberts (01:52)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, yeah, well, it's the humidity for me. It's like breathing in. It's

breathing in when you know when you open up an oven. That's what it feels like when you open up the door, isn't it?

Dom Okus (02:09)
Yes

Jordan Skelton (02:10)
Step out the shower and you're sweating again. Absolutely driven.

Dom Okus (02:12)
Yeah,

Jamil Roberts (02:14)
And the other lads they don't get it do they they're so used to it

Jordan Skelton (02:16)
Nah. Nah, they really don't.

Jamil Roberts (02:17)
they don't get it Mate our our center half Declan he won't mind me saying but he's like he's We'd we'd met we joke with him all the time that he'd need like a layer of sunscreen even when he'd walking in the train in the morning Yeah, yeah, yeah

Dom Okus (02:18)
literally.

Jordan Skelton (02:31)
Big Irish boy. He made Casper the friendly ghost man. Same

colour as my t-shirt that last.

Jamil Roberts (02:40)
my god Nah, I love that, he'll love that

Dom Okus (02:41)
Hahaha

Jordan Skelton (02:42)
He's a good boy, mate. We always had a good bit of banter on the field.

Jamil Roberts (02:48)
And just on the subject mate, obviously for those who don't know Jordan or don't necessarily recognize the accent is one proper Geordie boy so When you're out there or at least when you first went over there

Jordan Skelton (03:01)
So when you're out there...

Jamil Roberts (03:08)
It must have been a shock for some people to understand that accent.

Jordan Skelton (03:09)
It must have been a shock for some people to understand that

thought he was a jokester, you know, and was, you know, I'd be answering a question, he would just be like, you'd have to slow down, you'll have to say it again. So honestly, lads, you know, when I go to America, I sometimes fall into like a Yorkshire accent, as if I'm from like Donnie. So I'll talk like that, I'll talk real slow in like, and I don't even mean, I'm just trying to slow down, but I'll end up sounding like I'm from Doncaster, like Yorkshire. Because obviously I'm just trying to slow down my speech, but it's, it's something that's at the word.

Jamil Roberts (03:48)
Hehehehehe

You

I don't know if

don't know if either of you have ever experienced this but the first time I ever so I went over for college first semester come back on the Christmas

and I didn't even realize it but my mates absolutely hammered me Saying that I sounded different

I'm talking American

Jordan Skelton (04:19)
Mate, you know what it was? You

know what it was with me and Jam? I said trash. it was game over. I got absolutely melted, lads. I said the word trash and I got melted.

Jamil Roberts (04:32)
Dom, did you ever get any of that?

Dom Okus (04:34)
Yeah,

do know what is as well? I'm really relating to that. Even like slang, still like obviously you're a Geordie, right? So you might say howay or whatever it is, like certain slang that we use in London. You just can't use it there because I think you're talking another language. You know what mean? They're literally talking another language.

Jordan Skelton (04:35)
You know what it is as well, I'm really related to that. Even like, flat. Yeah. So like, obviously, your jewellery rights, you might see a way of...

Yeah,

Jamil Roberts (04:49)
I mean, I'm not gonna lie,

when Kaza first come to Tormenta, it was a bit like that for me as well. There were some words that he was throwing out that even I didn't understand. So the rest of the boys must have thought he was speaking Japanese or something.

Jordan Skelton (05:02)
I always have this of a joke where it's like obviously people will pick up on your accent and they're like where are from and I always say where do you think I'm and mate people never say England ever it's always like Scotland, Ireland I've had some mad shouts like South African, Australian I never ever get English ever

Jamil Roberts (05:16)
Seriously.

See, I get Australian, but I think compared to both of you, I feel like I'm a little bit more generic in the way

I talk. Like you two have got a very distinct dialect from where you're from in the UK. So it doesn't surprise me at all.

Jordan Skelton (05:32)
Yeah, I'd say so.

Dom Okus (05:33)
You

Jordan Skelton (05:38)
Yeah, but I think

a lot of the times like Americans will hear I or not even just Americans people will generally hear like I and they'll just stimulate straight Scottish, won't they? So.

Dom Okus (05:45)
in.

Jamil Roberts (05:48)
Yeah, Yeah,

Dom Okus (05:48)
yeah the

people know that this is going to be a stupid sound like a stupid question but do people even know where newcastle is? or know that it's a city i feel like most people are

Jamil Roberts (05:50)
very true.

Jordan Skelton (05:55)
Eh?

Dom Okus (05:58)
i feel like those people who are american no but most people are american know

Jamil Roberts (05:59)
just know he's a football team, they?

Jordan Skelton (05:59)
It's a story that's important to you, isn't it?

Dom Okus (06:04)
maybe birmingham

Jordan Skelton (06:03)
I mean, I've almost just spat all over my laptop there, man. That was

brilliant. No, 100%. Yeah, mate. Exactly. Take it back. Didn't work. Mate, honestly, if you see it, because this now I'm going to see this from the start, right? Because there'll be some lad that I know that it'll be already like if they happen to come across this like I'm from in the northeast. I'm from like a little town pretty much right in the middle of

Jamil Roberts (06:09)
Don't do that you've just you've just fought out fucking grand on that thing and you

Dom Okus (06:17)
You

Jordan Skelton (06:33)
County Durham and Newcastle. So, funny enough, I'm probably closer to County Durham than I am to Newcastle. I'm about 30 minutes from Durham, 20, 30 minutes, and 40, 45 minutes from the town. But I say Newcastle because no one knows County Durham. But like you said, not many people even know Newcastle. And we always go to is, you know the brown ale? The Newcastle brown ale? Because obviously that's massive out in America, the brown ale. So normally people would go.

Jamil Roberts (06:49)
Yeah, yeah,

cool Yeah, yeah, yeah, you'll find that you'll find that

Dom Okus (07:00)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jamil Roberts (07:02)
in that little like Irish pubs in that over there won't you like yeah, yeah, yeah

Jordan Skelton (07:05)
all the time mate, aye, so

normally it's the footy team and the brown ale, people are like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jamil Roberts (07:12)
the football team. you're New Castle fan, right? Senior

the game the other week. So when you're

Jordan Skelton (07:18)
I am. Yeah, I

Jamil Roberts (07:21)
football and you're talking about you when you were younger, who was your it was your heroes when it comes to Newcastle and watching them growing up.

Jordan Skelton (07:27)
You know what, mate? I'm gonna have to like, honest. was, loved Arsenal was my first love, eh. Honestly, and you know why, mate? I loved Fabregas when I was a kid. When I was like young, when I was, when I was young, young, it was obviously like, know, Thierry Henry, and then it was like Fabregas coming through as a youngster. But then I got to like, I don't know how old I was, you know, like young teens when your mates start to become...

Jamil Roberts (07:33)
wow.

Okay. Easy to love.

Jordan Skelton (07:53)
You start to get bullied really, don't you? We call it banter, but it's just pure bullying really. I got roped into like, can't support Arsenal you're not from London. You have to support Newcastle or Sunderland and if you support Sunderland you're not knocking around with us anymore. So was like, all right, I support Newcastle. And that was when we were absolutely cr*p. So I've had some rough years going, but now obviously we're not doing too bad.

Jamil Roberts (08:08)
Hehehehehe

Yeah, yeah, well it's amazing what a bit of money can do, isn't it?

Jordan Skelton (08:21)
or tell us about us.

Jamil Roberts (08:23)
Hehehehehe

Dom Okus (08:25)
And I feel like you make a point about Arsenal, I like most people born in the late 90s, Arsenal is like a team, even if you didn't support them, you really respected them. Like you say, you've got the invincibles and then even post invincibles, just the football they played, like you said, with the Fabregas, the

Jordan Skelton (08:26)
We'll right back.

Dom Okus (08:39)
players coming through. Unreal team, Unreal team. Basically.

Jordan Skelton (08:40)
man, it Orson Venger and Man United wanted it really. was like Orson Venger,

Sir Alex wanted it, that was still kind of going on then wanted so.

Dom Okus (08:48)
Yeah, basically.

Jamil Roberts (08:49)
Yeah, it's nice. It's good that you mentioned Cesc Fabregas actually, because I can see the comparisons in your style of play between the

Dom Okus (08:55)
What the fuck?

Jamil Roberts (09:00)
I

Dom Okus (09:01)
you

You

Jordan Skelton (09:08)
Yeah, 100%.

Jamil Roberts (09:10)
yeah, yeah, I can see where you get it from mate. I can see where you get it from

guess we can take it from Newcastle and sort of as you you make that progression and the jump to To the US. So who were you playing for back in Newcastle before you went over to Lander?

Jordan Skelton (09:23)
before you went over

to

Jamil Roberts (09:44)
I'll follow.

Jordan Skelton (09:52)
I played for just my local team when I was when I was a youngin up until about probably How old are you when you when you start playing for your district and your county and all that lads? I'm trying to think of how old you are. Can't even remember Yes started started playing for like me district on me county and then back then I was a center midfielder and like There he is. I just hit it in the chance playing center mid like a center back. So that's probably why

Dom Okus (10:05)
12 or 13? 12 or 13? Dunno.

Jamil Roberts (10:14)
Hoooo, there he is!

Turn him! Turn him!

Jordan Skelton (10:30)
So, I was a centre mid player and I started playing for the district and the county and basically the county I started to obviously just get tall, started to get hit in my grove spurt and there was a coach, a county, think his name was Jim Thompson I think if I remember rightly, it was even county, he said look I think you've got a chance of being I think you've got a chance of doing something in the game as a centre back but as a centre mid fielder I think there's better than you. I remember at the time I was like

No, I don't want to do that. And my dad was like, listen, son, if you want to, if you want to, if this wants to be fun or if you want to take it seriously, then George. So I went to center back and then things started to happen for us a little bit where, you know, clubs started to be interested, but it was never like academies or anything. It was always, you know, six week trials and development. then, you know, Carlisle and Hartlepool were interested a little bit, but never, never actually made the jump to it. So it came to 16 where I remember I had a friend that

was going to Gateshead. Now Gateshead over here in the North East are like a, I think they're a fifth division team now. And they had this kind of, yeah, something like that, right? And they had like a set, I remember it was like labeled as like a last chance, like, cause some people obviously listen to this, they might not realize, but if you're not playing like top level by like 18 in England, you're almost considered done on you really. So it was like, you know, last chance kind of get yourself into the top.

Jamil Roberts (11:29)
Yeah, I the National League, yeah.

Jordan Skelton (11:50)
well not the top but a good level of football. I went to Gateshead and done that old level three BTEC thing and was there for two years and 16 to 18 and then I got asked, say got asked, I fortunately, I got the opportunity to play for England Schoolboys. So I all the Lily Shoals stuff and met a bunch of boys from the South. And basically there was a guy came in and sold the dream of America and then obviously that chapter started so.

Dom Okus (12:06)
Sick.

Jordan Skelton (12:19)
really made it was boys hood clubs to answer your question. Just like local town boys teams and then when I hit 16 I started playing for Gateshead and then I think it was a men's team or a team I think it was called Seaham Red Star. I knew all the lads in the area that were good players that weren't pros were playing for this team. So we all had a crack of playing there and that was pretty much the last road stop before I jumped on a plane.

Jamil Roberts (12:48)
And I know, Dom, you've probably jumped in a little bit more on this because obviously you, you're a Tottenham and then got released and you, you played for the county and all that as well. So just talk to us a little bit about like that. that sort of, I guess, pathway, cause you both sort of came through, I guess, a similar last two years before you made the jump to the U S. So what does that look like for all of our U S listeners?

Dom Okus (13:14)
Yeah, so for me, specifically, I didn't go to like a college or anything where you're kind of almost full time and studying a little bit kind of like what Jordan's described me doing your beta. I just went to like a full sixth form and then played for Concord Rangers under 18s. So like they were in the conference half or whatever. I played for them under 18s, a decent setup. But I think for me, still got to play for like my county and play at a good level and play at the best level you could without being in an academy.

Jordan Skelton (13:15)
V

Dom Okus (13:44)
and that was able to like basically keep me at a higher level, especially in London. It's super

Like you'll find ballers that like

Jordan Skelton (13:51)
me and Albers.

Dom Okus (13:54)
playing in non-league at 17, 18, I don't know, random, at the time, bagging 15, 16 goals, but I can't get a look in at any of the academies. So that's super competitive. And so that's the level I was playing at. And I'm sure it was the same for you, Jordan, right? Where you're probably good enough to play for an academy somewhere, but where you are, it's just super competitive and it's difficult for you to get a look.

Jordan Skelton (14:13)
Right, exactly.

Jamil Roberts (14:16)
Yeah, yeah, that's interesting because obviously you mentioned Kazza and Pedro and a few of our other guests before and I didn't actually know that because I just went through the standard. I was at Plymouth Argyle, did the YT, took a year out and then went over to the States. So

wasn't aware of these other pathways that lads had to go through.

Jordan Skelton (14:33)
SHUT

Well, that's probably

the traditional one in a jam. Most of the time, if you'll have lads out in the States and stuff that have played, that are pros or have played pro or have took the football somewhere, most of the time they've done a YTS somewhere, they? To use knowledge that, not to use the lingo that everyone will know. They've been at a pro club for a little bit of time. Whereas for me, was like, was just, never made that jump. It was always like...

Jamil Roberts (14:49)
Yeah, yeah.

Jordan Skelton (15:02)
or we're interested in like you come in for six weeks, like I think I went in for like four or five, six week trials through like my life as a kid from being like, you know, 10, 12 to then obviously leaving, but just never landed. So there was always just something there.

Jamil Roberts (15:08)
Wow.

So many cases of that

Dom Okus (15:16)
I you.

Jamil Roberts (15:17)
so many cases of that And and good players like yourself as well like they've obviously gone on and done something you think about how many players have slipped through the net You know, obviously you've taken that that extended pathway But there's probably the lit the list of people that that we could that we could probably name all three of us in our local area that you think he could have played pro or you could have done something in the game or you could have done this or that or whatever but because it just Didn't happen for them, you know right place right time sort of thing. They just never get the opportunity

Dom Okus (15:19)
think what I would add to that is...

Jordan Skelton (15:20)
Yeah.

100 % man.

100 % Matt

Dom Okus (15:47)
Yeah, and the only thing I was sad is

that you was probably good enough to play at the academies you went on trial to, but you probably didn't show, and you probably won't remember me saying it, you probably didn't show that you was better than them, which is why they didn't sign me. So remember being at Charlton under 15 and being told, look, you've come on trial, you've done well, but you're not better than anything we've got, so like, we're not going to sign you. And that's what people don't

is that you're probably good enough to be an academy player, but it's tough.

Jordan Skelton (16:08)
Dom, you know what it was

for me mate? The penny didn't really drop till, I want to say like I was even out in America, when I was a young and still again, up until I was out in college, football just consumed my life man. So it was almost like, I know myself and I'd openly admit this now, I'd be a nervous wreck mate.

Dom Okus (16:30)
BOOM

Mm-hmm.

Jordan Skelton (16:37)
be a

nervous wreck and it would be like, well, hang on, this is why, this is what you want. Like this is what you want to achieve. why are you letting it, and it wasn't honestly lads, it wasn't until I was probably out in America for a little bit, but I realized like, hold on, when I wanted too much, I'm nowhere near me best. And it got into the place of becoming like, you know, going out there, being willing to say this could go crap. And if it does, I'm all right with this. So that's why I think, you know, when I look at some of these lads, right.

Jamil Roberts (17:03)
Mm-hmm.

Jordan Skelton (17:05)
I'm like, well, I'm just as good as him. How is he? You know, I've got mates that are playing in the championship now. I'm like, we hang on. Funny enough, one of them was a Plymouth or Gile and I played with the England schoolboys. He's a bit of a, he was a baller like Mustafa Bundu. what a player he was by the way. But you know what I think the biggest thing is, is lads, when I think like, you know, Bellingham is the biggest one now. I think like these lads not only doing what they're doing at their age, but they've got the mindset for it as well.

Jamil Roberts (17:16)
yeah.

Yeah, the the the white player yeah, yeah, yeah

Aw yeah.

Jordan Skelton (17:36)
because it's

all fine and well doing at Monday to Friday but it's when obviously you cross the white lines and there's there's something on the line where it's like maturity maybe, that maybe the best way to say it? I didn't have that when I was a young man, didn't have it.

Jamil Roberts (17:48)
I think so. I think so.

Dom Okus (17:50)
Mm.

Jamil Roberts (17:51)
Yeah, I'm still looking for it.

Jordan Skelton (17:53)
HAHA

Dom Okus (17:53)
hahahahah

Jordan Skelton (17:57)
It's easier to

hide when you just put stuff in the channel jam. It's so much easier to hide. You can just blame the lads for not making the run.

Jamil Roberts (18:00)
Yeah. mate.

Dom Okus (18:01)
Yes.

Jamil Roberts (18:06)
honestly, this year at Chattanooga, I've never been told to stick it the channel so much, and it's mad because that's all I used to do as a youngin', and then I'd come into college and then, like, go to Kansas City. mate. I'm zipping balls into a filter, strike his feet, this and that, go to Chattanooga. Yeah, jam, just hit the channel in there.

Jordan Skelton (18:17)
Ball playing. Ball playing.

Brilliant

man. Brilliant.

Jamil Roberts (18:28)
Back to basics.

But anyway, you use the good word there, maturity. And I think another word that myself and anyone who's come across you and seen you play and shared the pitch with you is I think is people associate you with being a leader. You've been a captain at a lot of places you go and I think it's easy to see why. So how did that happen?

Were you always a captain when you were younger of all your schoolboy teams or did it happen once you went over to the US? Obviously I know there's a difference between English lads and American lads in terms of communication on the pitch certainly and whatever but was it just a natural progression for you as you got older or have you always been that sort of leader type?

Jordan Skelton (19:16)
Great question. think a bit of both probably. I think number one, I've always just been a mouthy little prick. you know, I've always just like I can talk to an empty room as you've probably already been able to tell. So I've always just had, you know, the comfort to use my voice, which I think, you know, probably in

Jamil Roberts (19:27)
Ha ha!

Jordan Skelton (19:46)
probably back in the day to use that old slogan. It was probably a lot more common on the football pitch where it's becoming a little bit less so I feel like, but I've just always had that voice on the field and probably in truth, it's probably been one of the things that I think is a young one that I thought could maybe separate me. And we're again going back to the pros and things, but obviously when you're going in on trial, you don't want to be running your mouth because these lads will be like, who the hell is this?

Jamil Roberts (20:13)
Yeah

Jordan Skelton (20:13)
But obviously

I used to think it was one of my strengths. So I think it's just been one of those things, Jam, where it was, I realized very quickly that if I can make lads around me a little bit better, that makes me valuable. So like if I can make my centre back partner or midfield partner or right back or left back play 5 % better, like that's of value. And I think I had that in my head from being like you know, being like a late teenager when I was starting to kind of

Jamil Roberts (20:28)
Yep. Yeah, yeah.

Dom Okus (20:28)
to

Jordan Skelton (20:43)
you know, you'll know yourselves when the men's game starts kind of being a potential opportunity, you know, because obviously I played youth football all the way to 17 and then when I turned 17, I started to play a little bit like senior football. And you realize when you go to that, like it's doggy dog, like if you shrink, you're just going to get left behind. I realized early having a bit of a voice, give you a bit of a presence. And then if you helped your team, you could help your unit. And then it was almost domino effect. So I think it was a little bit natural. I was comfortable with me with my voice on the pitch and then

I realised that there was a place and a value for it.

Jamil Roberts (21:15)
Right, okay, makes sense. Now, and I can definitely agree with you because at least this season especially, we had obviously myself and then Declan that we mentioned before. And that was something that we just took upon ourselves because there weren't many voices on the pitch. So the gaffer turned around to the pair of us and just said, like, I need you two to be me

Jordan Skelton (21:40)
Peace.

Jamil Roberts (21:40)
But the one thing you touched on making players better around you for me,

It's that plus. If I'm talking to, for me, I left back there, I'm talking to me left midfielder, I'm talking to me center midfielder inside, obviously me left center half. Yeah, okay, I'm making them better around me, but also for me, it's, if they know what I'm

and I know what they're doing at all times, it makes my life easier. So I can't.

Jordan Skelton (22:03)
It's helping you isn't it? It makes more like it yeah. 100 %

aye.

Jamil Roberts (22:07)
can't

understand why lads don't talk on the pitch anymore. Like Dom, I know you played centre half as well. Was that something that you, you know, from our time playing together, I know you were a vocal lad, but was that always something for you as well?

Dom Okus (22:19)
Yeah, I think that was the biggest adjustment for me even getting to play in the US is that a lot of these players are silent. And I'm like, how are you playing football in

Jordan Skelton (22:26)
Right.

Dom Okus (22:28)
give information. I've been taught that since I was like eight. Pass the ball and give information, turn, set, hold it. You know, where you want the ball, like all of these things. And so, yeah, it's just kind of ingrained in a coach. And I think it's like a little bit of like how your football education was.

You know, like I remember being in session and being told, it's too quiet.

Jordan Skelton (22:44)
100 %

Dom Okus (22:49)
like speak up, everyone start speaking, it's too quiet in there, know, like from a young age. So I think it's just embedded in us and something that needs to be embedded in some of the US kids as they're playing football. Like just don't be scared to speak, like it's okay, like, you know, you can ask for the ball, you know?

Jamil Roberts (22:50)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jordan Skelton (22:51)
All right

Jamil Roberts (23:01)
Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (23:04)
100. But

even you know another one as well lads that I think is so powerful is even just saying well done. Is even saying, lads like honestly I've played, my time at Knox I've been very fortunate to play with some really good defenders and you've hit the nail on the head there Jam. When I have them talking to me it's like, this is like a breath of fresh air. So if I'm in a 1v1 moment and I'm hearing like

Jamil Roberts (23:12)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Honestly.

Jordan Skelton (23:34)
keep them down the line, keep them down the line, keep them down the line. I go like, right, I'm trusting you. I'm keeping them down the line. And then, you know, the actions when something's done, like you lads know yourself, when your peers on the field see it, you're like, fucking well done, Jam. You're like, yes, like it lifts you, lifts you. man, a hundred percent. I think, and it's even, it's even for me, I'm not taught, and this is again, like where I think,

Jamil Roberts (23:38)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't even think about it, do you?

Sometimes it means more than like coming from the gaffer, doesn't it? On the sideline. Like, at least in that moment itself.

Jordan Skelton (24:03)
It's partly, it's the twofold of partly being natural and partly being like, can see value in us is like, you can't force it. You know, some lads are just naturally quiet lads. So trying to make them, like trying to make them communicate can actually take them off their game. So I think for me, I think it has to be a little bit natural, but I think things of just saying well done,

Jamil Roberts (24:16)
100%.

Jordan Skelton (24:31)
of being a good teammate of X, Y and Z, anybody and everybody can do. But being a big bellowing voice that your gaff has asked you to do, I feel like you've got to have that. Because that's where think it comes into another conversation of you can lead in many different ways, can't you? Doesn't just have to be your voice.

Dom Okus (24:37)
Hmm

Jamil Roberts (24:48)
Yeah, 100%. 100%.

Dom Okus (24:48)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (24:50)
And I mean, just on that subject there as well, I you think about some of the best players have played the game. You you look at someone like, I don't know, Steven Gerrard, for example, obviously a vocal guy around the pitch, but that's someone as well that leads by example. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? And it's not just rah rah rah shouting at everyone and making sure everyone's in line. Like there's sometimes there's players that take the game by the scruff of the neck. Sometimes don't even wear the armband.

Jordan Skelton (25:04)
led by example 100 % myth and like

No.

Jamil Roberts (25:17)
that will take the game by the scruff of the neck and the rest of the lads will follow.

Jordan Skelton (25:22)
100 % and I think that's where again that leads back into there has to be it has to be natural for you and it's always just been fairly natural for me in the sense of you know praising people encouraging moving the unit which obviously is part of the job for a defender really isn't it and I think the the biggest one for me that I've had to kind of manage probably a little bit better with moving to America was probably the

Jamil Roberts (25:38)
Yeah, 100%.

Jordan Skelton (25:50)
the carrot in the stick for example, in America that doesn't always go down well. And having to learn, probably more so in myself, I'm actually being the bad, if it's not helping the player and it's not helping the team, it doesn't matter if I think it's right. And having to adapt to that's been something that I've had to do.

Jamil Roberts (25:53)
The hammer-ins.

Dom Okus (25:54)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (26:15)
Yeah, yeah.

Dom Okus (26:16)
I wanna actually

keep going on that. like, there any situations where you were misunderstood?

I think I can speak from my own experience.

Jordan Skelton (26:22)
Dom! 100!

Probably more than the other way.

Dom Okus (26:28)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (26:31)
misunderstood like they didn't understand what he was saying or...

Dom Okus (26:31)
Yeah, yeah, yeah,

Jordan Skelton (26:34)
Well, not the... Maybe that's what it was! Maybe

Dom Okus (26:34)
Both.

Jordan Skelton (26:37)
that was the problem! Yeah, well we'll see if that was the problem. Will he say that? Yeah, not that he's a prick. We'll say I just didn't understand it. No, I think... You know what that is, lads? Genuinely. And I think it comes back what was said earlier on. I've gotten better out of thanks to the blessing of my faith, since my faith's become important in my life. But football used to be everything to me. And I mean like...

Dom Okus (26:39)
Stop.

Jamil Roberts (26:40)
No!

Dom Okus (26:44)
Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (27:02)
If I didn't win a small sided game in training, that meant nothing. I wouldn't, I couldn't, I couldn't be okay for a little bit. Now, you know, I used to think that's a good thing. I used to think competitiveness, that's a good thing. The desire to win, like that's a good thing. And I think, be fair, there's, think that's got us to where I am because there's a lot more talented boys than I am that have, you know, fell by the wayside. But for me,

Jamil Roberts (27:06)
Here we are.

Jordan Skelton (27:31)
That was good up until a point where it started to be detrimental because then it was like, I started to view teammates, lads, where if I didn't think they'd help me win, I didn't want to have to deal with them. Which, which I realized was again, wasn't helpful for the team. So I had to adapt that, know, and I think one of the biggest things, to come back to your thing was, like, I said it earlier, it can come across as bullying. It can come across as like,

Jamil Roberts (27:42)
Right.

Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (27:59)
Who's this guy? I had a bit of a time at North Carolina where it was a younger squad. I look back on it now and think I was bollocking some 16-year-old lads. And I'm like, how would that have been for you when you were 16? know, fine, well, it wouldn't have worked for you. So a little bit of it.

Jamil Roberts (28:22)
Yeah, yeah. Yeah,

definitely. Yeah. And you know what? I like the you reflected there a little bit because obviously it speaks to like your you talked about how you developed into that leadership role, but it's definitely something that you've sort of reassessed many a time. And it's funny you mentioned North Carolina there because obviously you played it. We're goosey there, didn't you? And yeah.

Jordan Skelton (28:46)
what a boy, mate. You've got to get him on here. He is a legend,

Dom. Mr. Fernandes himself. Mr. Worldwide.

Jamil Roberts (28:51)
Yeah,

Mr. Worldwide I tell you I'll tell you now so Well, I guess I'm telling everyone so our I I did our end of season awards for the players this past year And goose he came away with four. He came away with best dressed funniest teammate

Dom Okus (28:55)
Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (29:06)
brilliant.

Worst breath.

Jamil Roberts (29:18)
One other and Top Shagger

Jordan Skelton (29:21)
Yeah,

he did. Longest in the shower, top shagger bosh What a boy, man. Honestly, North Carolina was massive for me in my life, And obviously fell away from, I don't know if we're going to come to it, but fell away from the pros, got back at the pros. And I was told very early, look, our whole ethos here, they'd just come down from the champ, right? So it was all about the whole, what do they call them, man?

Dom Okus (29:22)
This is

Hehehehehe

Jamil Roberts (29:27)
you

Jordan Skelton (29:50)
the academy contracts where it's like they could have a lot of these academy contracts and then we're going to really try hard to push these lads to Europe. And they had like four, they had four boys that were like, right, these are our four. And to be fair, one or two of them were dancing around Europe a little bit and getting on trials and stuff. So they were doing really well, but I got told from the, I don't think any of them panned out, mate, to be fair. But there's two of them that are still in the pro system in America doing well for themselves. And I think they've got a really good shot. There's a, well, there's actually three.

Jamil Roberts (29:52)
yeah, yeah.

Did it pan out for any of them?

Jordan Skelton (30:19)
I lied, there's three that are still in the pro system and there's one that I think he maybe tried his hand in somewhere in Europe. I don't know how he's doing, but basically I got told like, look, you might have a 16 year old goalie and a 17 year old centre back next to you. Like, just let me know that on the upfront. And I was like, absolutely fine. But that centre back, that was the young one I got on with so well, but he went away for Europe on like the whole of pre-season. was around Europe. Gussi was there. As a walk on, as a trialist, Gussi was there.

Jamil Roberts (30:49)
Yeah, because he come from Madison's U, didn't he?

Jordan Skelton (30:49)
And mate,

yes, he wasn't even signed. And I remember being like, again, that little bit of me old self being like, hang on, who's this guy sent about, like target acquired, like type of thing, you know? And but then straight away it was like, he's the boy, man. He's just the boy. So then me and him became really, really good friends, man.

Jamil Roberts (30:59)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah,

Jordan Skelton (31:16)
or his brother, his brother's way better than he is so just bin

Dom Okus (31:18)
Mwahahahaha!

Jordan Skelton (31:19)
Goosie off

and get Leo!

Jamil Roberts (31:23)
mate, you know what? I'll... I'll... Yeah, I'll pitch it as the Fernandez brothers.

Jordan Skelton (31:25)
Just use Goosie! Use Goosie to get the Leo!

Dom Okus (31:28)
you

Jordan Skelton (31:31)
And then, yeah, it'd be like, so Gustavo, is that Leo there? Leo, Leo!

Dom Okus (31:32)
I'm sorry.

Jamil Roberts (31:35)
What?

Jordan Skelton (31:38)
yeah like brilliant he'll be dying in that

Jamil Roberts (31:42)
you

Dom Okus (31:42)
hilarious, hilarious.

So

Jamil Roberts (31:46)
mate. I can't wait for his brother to sit to hear that as well, you know.

Jordan Skelton (31:50)
Yeah, he's the boy.

Dom Okus (31:52)
So obviously we transitioned from Newcastle to the US, obviously you played in college, you said you was in the South in South Carolina and then a little bit about you kind of moving into the program and being a leader everywhere you go. So talk to us a little bit about the transition from college to the pro game because obviously from what I understand you didn't actually play like a Division 1 school, it wasn't a thing where you got drafted. So again, a kind of unconventional story. So just tell us a little bit about how you moved into the pro game

Jordan Skelton (32:02)
little bit about moving into the program.

Talk to us.

did not say last at the beginning.

Yeah, so for me, I came, like I said, I was with KTED and I was with the England Schoolboys and I was kind of gathering information, but knew very, very little about the American, the American world, so to speak. And I had four or five offers come through to, well, I had more than four or five, but I whittled it down to four or five of like, right, these are the four or five schools I'm interested in. And it was like St. John's, Lowell, Boston, Massachusetts.

Southern Illinois University, Edwardsville, Fairleigh Dickinson. And there was another D1 school, I can't remember. But then there was this D2 school that told us they were getting like, lads from Exocity, lads from Leighton Orient, lads from Chesterfield, lads from, like, and I was like, hang on, they're getting like six English lads. They're bringing, like, it just sounded like it was gonna be a full English team, boys. So I was like, right, I'm gonna add that into the list. And all of these teams told us like,

get this on your SAT, blah dee blah dee blah. Ended up getting exactly what the SAT score needed to get a full ride at Lander. So went to Lander, which was this little D2 schoolboys in Greenwood, South Carolina, right, Jam. Similar kind of vibe to Statesborough, similar-ish, which is obviously for people listening where you've played obviously in the past. Like just a fishbowl, just an absolute bubble of a town, like everybody knows what's going on. So I realized fairly quickly, exactly.

Jamil Roberts (33:36)
Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

All about the Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (33:50)
Exactly.

I realised very quickly Dom, that Lander wasn't probably going to get me into the pros. It was going to be at the time I got told about this PDL, which has obviously changed a little bit now at the USL2 and stuff, but I got told, listen, Lander's not going to get you into the draft or anything. Like you might get a few trials, but it's the summer that's going to get you a look in. So lads, played every summer from being a freshman. I never went home until Christmas every year in America.

Dom Okus (34:02)
Yeah

Jordan Skelton (34:21)
So I played freshman year sophomore, junior seat. Well, I didn't end up playing senior because I graduated. And I was like, first summer I played for a small PDL team. Second summer ended up going with Mark McKeever, a briller. Third summer, a briller. And then the fourth summer, I went with Tormenta, which obviously is where Jam played his few of his pro seasons. And I played there for their two team. We're done really well. Just, I think we're finished in the semifinals. I think we're lost to Redden.

And then long story short, they kept me around and I signed at the end of that summer for the Pro Team. So it was kind of like a natural transition where when I left college, I had a really good year in the summer where I got, you you lads might know about the top prospect in the PDL, the team of the season. I got a few sweet accolades to get us in the shop window. The thing is, like you said, Dom, I was a D2 boy and an international D2 boy.

Jamil Roberts (35:10)
Yeah, yeah.

Jordan Skelton (35:18)
which straight away your stock goes like, know? So it was like, right, let's just see what happens. Didn't, trust us, mate. So didn't get any draft, none of that. was like, right, you're gonna have to go on with trials. Because not to go on a big tangent, but when I finished my summer and finished my school year, I built up a good enough recognition where there was teams looking at us. And there was St. Louis, who were in the championship at the time, Greenville.

Jamil Roberts (35:23)
I'm still feeling that now, mate. Still feeling that now.

Jordan Skelton (35:47)
And who was the other team? Tormenta I think. That basically all three of them were like, look, we're going to give you a contract. And I went and met with John Harkes at Greenville for a coffee. I thought, because Greenville, South Carolina is like 30 minutes away from where I went to school, right? So I this will be, this will be ledge. But ended up what happened is Anthony, I think it was Anthony Pulis at St. Louis was like, look, we'll give you this contract. And I was like, Ledge, like championship, jumping on it. One the things that happened is my agent and the club were trying to dance around contracts where the contract ended up getting pulled, lads.

Jamil Roberts (36:00)
Yeah, I was gonna say, yeah, yeah.

Jordan Skelton (36:16)
So I got told off the head coach, I got told off Pulis like, look, we want you, we're going to have you. I told Harkes, like, look, no disrespect, I just want to try and get in the championship. So Harkes understood. I told Tormenta, championship. And then my agent was trying to get something with St. Louis where there was going to be like a year, was a year in an option contract, very minimal for a rookie. But my agent was trying to get like a trigger so that the second year would trigger into like an automatic contract.

Dom Okus (36:17)
No way.

Jordan Skelton (36:45)
And it was just going back and forward and the general manager at St. Louis just went, it's just, it's not happening anymore. So I was like, no. So then lads, run to my, I run to Greenville and Hawks is like, listen, you told us, no, I've, I've, I've, went and explored other options. Completely fair enough. Go to Tormenta. They say the same thing. So then ended up having to be in the summer and then grafting in the summer. I played in the summer for probably three or four weeks lads and we played Chattanooga Red Wolves in the first open cup game.

So I'm playing for the two team, mate, we scouted Chattanooga Red Wolves like 3-1 in the first round of the Open Cup and then we'll play in Nashville the next round. Went to Nashville, lads. And I remember I went up for a header against Cam Lancaster and he's bumped us like the classic smaller striker thing. I've went up for a header and he's given us the old like bob. Lads, I landed me knee like hyper extended, like snap, crackle, pop, heard all of it, lads. So.

Jamil Roberts (37:30)
Yeah

Jordan Skelton (37:43)
I remember like thinking I'm against Nashville. This is my chance. Now I'm in the trenches now trying to get a contract. So I remember like thinking right how I come on was the 30th minute mark. I played the rest of the game, lads, just purely on adrenaline. I woke up on the next morning. I thought my leg had been cut off. like I've, I've broke, I've broke me arm lads. I broke me arm, snapped me arm in two places. I've been knocked out probably three or four times. I've never felt pain like this in me knee ever. So I was like,

using all yourselves straight away, you're going, it's the dreaded ACL, right? It's the ACL. I go and get scans and basically what the guy, what the surgeon told us was, I hadn't snapped my ACL, but I'd stretched it so much. You use this analogy of like, it lost its elasticity. So my ACL didn't have an end point anymore. So my knee was like going beyond it's like, where it would meant to stop because of the ACL, it was going beyond it.

Dom Okus (38:17)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (38:17)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Dom Okus (38:40)
it.

Jordan Skelton (38:43)
So lads, I'm thinking, hang on, I'm going to be in the pros here. I'm fighting for me pros. I didn't get a pro. I've now potentially done my ACL. I'm getting booked in for surgery in three or four weeks because they had to let the swelling come down from the knee. So I'm like, I'm like, good Lord, am I, like Lord, what is going on here? Right. I'm still in international at the time. So I'm getting ready to go into surgery and I don't know what it is boys, right? I was just like, God, I'll do anything.

Dom Okus (38:58)
Peace.

Jordan Skelton (39:14)
Like, I just was like, anything, don't let this be my knee. So I just started to do a little bit of exercises, just little bits, lads, like nothing stupid. I went back three weeks later to do the checkup to make sure everything was right again. And the doctor said, look, I've never seen this in my entire life, that knee, I wouldn't operate on that knee. And I was like...

I like, what? He's like, I wouldn't operate on that knee. would let that knee, it's gotten so much better. may even get like, so lads, was like, God, thank you. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. I played a week later in the first round of the playoffs for Tormenta, played two or three games and then ended up giving us a pro a few months later.

Dom Okus (39:50)
No way.

Mad story! Mad story! Wow!

Jamil Roberts (40:02)
Wow.

Wow, that is...

Jordan Skelton (40:06)
So I went

from like graduating, had like a good summer, good final year in college, got a few accolades, got in the shop window, got a few pros, didn't get a pro, come into summer, come into tournament, are doing well, doing well, do your knee, told it's your ACL, rock bottom, somehow find a miraculous healing biopsy, I only give it by the grace of God, end up doing alright in the last few games, and end up getting a pro a couple of months later. So mate, Dom, my getting into the pros,

I don't know how it happened really. Don't know how it happened.

Jamil Roberts (40:39)
mate.

Dom Okus (40:39)
It's not easy man. This is the stories that we're trying to get out here man. It's not easy bro. It's not easy bro. The ups and downs are mad. Jam what do think?

Jamil Roberts (40:43)
Yeah.

Mate, that is the craziest story and do know what? Like, I'm not just saying it because you're on here. I really think like football is such a cruel game. football, football, like at the end of the day, like we all love it. We all love it to death as well. We still play it, but it's shit

Jordan Skelton (41:00)
Yeah, I'm a-

Jamil Roberts (41:07)
because

Jordan Skelton (41:07)
Yeah, man.

Dom Okus (41:07)
Yep.

Jamil Roberts (41:08)
so many good people that like yourself that have such a tough ride to get in just where they want to be, just to a level where.

they're happy playing out and playing to their absolute maximum. like life just froze these fucking

boulders in front of them.

Jordan Skelton (41:26)
Yeah bro.

Wait, you know what Jam, just to add even on, the next year was Covid lads.

So my first year in the pros, I finished that year, because obviously as you know, you're playing the summer, you're playing like, what is it, like June, July, August, like you play like during those summer times, don't you? I got signed, I think, like in that August period after the, I'm pretty sure it was after the summer, sometime in that period, played that year. And then the following year was COVID. So like my first, like, right, this is my first full year in the pros. Like, I don't know if you...

Jamil Roberts (41:44)
Yeah, yeah.

Jordan Skelton (42:01)
I don't know if you were playing then, Jam, I think you were still in college, but was like, all the seasons gonna get cancelled and contracts are gonna get made void. That was was chat around the league, Dom. Like, they might scrap the league, they might scrap the contracts. And it's like, well hang on, I'm in the national lab, what does that mean for me, Visa? So all of this is going on, you know? So you talk about, like you said, just the cruelty of the game, like listen, everybody has it in life, don't do the ups and downs, but add that to the mix and it was an interesting pot, like.

Jamil Roberts (42:07)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've heard all the stories, yeah.

Yeah, I bet you just felt like you were just getting punched like one jab after another after another and then they just started becoming left hook, right hooks

Dom Okus (42:31)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (42:38)
of nowhere.

Jordan Skelton (42:39)
Aye.

And then you're in Statesboro, Georgia, where, you know, it's again, it's like a fishbowl and there's, there's nothing else other than the school, but it's like a, you know, there's not much of an escape and you weren't, we were getting told like, don't go out, go and then go back to your house, like nothing because of COVID. And then listen, I don't want to go too deep with you lads, cause I know this is a, I know this is a, a, I don't want to say a lighthearted podcast, but like that was my first taste lads where I talked about me, meant like the

Dom Okus (42:40)
like

Jamil Roberts (42:41)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

not much of an escape there.

Jordan Skelton (43:09)
The game being too much. That for me was when my, the point where things just went like pop for me. Because that was when my mental health like spiraled like mad. Because all I'd relied on the whole time was the game. And the game had kind of been going all right for us, which then means you rely on it even more. And then all of a sudden it wasn't going all right. And then it was like, what the heck? What's going on now? And it just went absolute.

Jamil Roberts (43:34)
Yeah, yeah, and the bubble burst,

yeah.

Jordan Skelton (43:38)
dive, bomb, mate, because then the football doesn't even become joyful anymore. It doesn't become, it just becomes like, it become a place of like, I have to win here to be okay. And if I don't win, what's the point? Which is when it became like a dangerous place to be, lads. So, but I again, thankfully, I'm very grateful for that experience because that then, the end of that year, like the guy that was my summer coach became the head coach.

Jamil Roberts (43:44)
I have to do this. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, it's a dangerous place to be.

Jordan Skelton (44:06)
Ian Cameron who's now there, obviously now jam, yeah. So he at the of the year was like, look, like, I just don't think there's going to be a place here for you. at the time, I couldn't understand that. was like, hang on, like what, what? don't understand it, but I can understand now looking back, because I became a terrible person. Like again, like I became terrible. And then I remember leaving that and coming into the summer and then it was like, right, hopefully we can, hopefully we can get your head right here.

Jamil Roberts (44:07)
Is that camo? Yeah.

Jordan Skelton (44:34)
and actually get the game to be what it used to be. And that was when I obviously went into playing for Des Moines Menace in the summer and had a good experience with Des Moines Menace and reunited back up with Mark McKeever and had a pretty good summer that year, won the whole thing. And that was then what kind of propelled me getting to be like, look, can actually, there's still the fire in the belly here and it can be a good thing.

Jamil Roberts (44:55)
Yeah, but

sure it was a mixture of that, also, shit, I can play football here and it can be fun.

it doesn't have to be like the be all and end all.

Dom Okus (45:03)
you

Jordan Skelton (45:04)
100%.

Jamil Roberts (45:05)
you know what mean? Like I can have fun whilst doing this.

sure that

Jordan Skelton (45:09)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (45:10)
only were you enjoying it on the pitch, but you were probably better in the changing room. You were probably better around the place, on the training ground. And that's things that people don't realise. Like it's not just the person you see on a Saturday afternoon or a Saturday evening on the pitch.

you know, with the name and number on your

Jordan Skelton (45:26)
Nuh.

Jamil Roberts (45:27)
it's the Monday to Friday, it's the what you like in the changing room, like, that all goes into being a player, innit?

I bet once those sort of dominoes started to fall into place, I'm sure, then all of a sudden, you take a step back and you go, shit, this game's, this is what I remember, this is why I started playing.

Jordan Skelton (45:34)
That's it, miss.

It's meant to be, like, there's a balance, but it's meant to be joyful. It's meant to be passion-based. Do you what I mean? And you know what it became for me, lads? It became like a, it became a prison. became done well and won. was like, thank the Lord. Lost, didn't win, didn't play well. My entire identity became under threat. And it was like, well, if they don't think of me as the best centre-back in the league now.

Dom Okus (46:11)
you

Jordan Skelton (46:16)
And it was like, that was my thing. It was like, have to be the best center back in the league, have to be the best center back in the league. And whenever that got like threatened, my whole world fell apart. And it was like, we just say that to yourself and how does that sound to yourself? And you're like, yeah, it does sound very stable. But thankfully that journey panned its way out to where now, you know, I look at the game and listen, still have the fire for it and still want to, you know, desire to win and do anything to win. I try and go out there on the field now of like,

Jamil Roberts (46:33)
So.

Jordan Skelton (46:45)
You know, giving it to God to say, if this goes terrible, I'm going to be alright. I'll probably not be happy and I'll not be okay with this, but I'll be alright. You know, and thankfully again by the grace of God I've been able to get to that place.

Jamil Roberts (46:52)
100%.

Yeah, mate.