Aaron Walker - Has Football Become Boring? And How Important Is The ‘Art’ Of Man Management? - E17

The boys welcome USL League One legend Aaron Walker on the pod this week. Aaron made a name for himself during his unprecedented years of success with Greenville Triumph, but now finds himself in a different role. We dig deep into what made Greenville such a special time for Aaron, from the titles to the culture. The conversation delves into the dynamics of his recent transition into a player-coach role with Tormenta, a club Jam knows very well, and learning under Coach Ian Cameron as he forms who he wants to be as a coach. We discuss the evolving landscape of football, and whether football has now become boring, with modern football being so tactic driven and players playing with much less freedom. Aaron shares insights on managing player relationships and the challenges of balancing playing and coaching roles, and as always, we finish up with Extra Time. Enjoy the show!

00:00 Intro & Subscribe To The Pod!

02:55 Aaron Walker: 2023 Off Season

06:19 Playing In The TST 2024 With Ocho Cinco

13:15 Transitioning to a Player-Coach Role With Tormenta

17:31 Learning From Ian Cameron

23:09 The Art Of Man Management

30:25 The Changing Landscape of Football Culture

34:45 Has Football Become Boring?

38:54 Aaron Walker & Greenville Triumph

46:07 2020 USL League One Championship Celebrations

52:19 Extra Time

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Transcript

Jamil Roberts (00:00)
Hello everyone and welcome to the Backstik Podcast. I'm Jamil Roberts and I'm joined here as usual by Dom Ocas. Dom, two things for you mate. One, how are ya? And two, I just, I just, I feel like we need to get this out of the way early on in the show, right?

I want you to have a word with the listeners and tell them what they need to do immediately before we get in to the content of this episode. So I'll take it away,

Dom Okus (00:31)
Yeah, so if you're listening to this, like maybe I'm in your car or your headphones, I just need you to turn this bit up. So like whatever volume you've got for me, just turn it up a little bit. If you're watching this, just come closer. Why have you not subscribed? Why? Tell me why. Because I know you're enjoying the content, you're back again, you're here to listen to this wonderful story. We've got a great guest today. I just don't understand why you haven't liked, why you haven't subscribed.

why I'm not maybe engaging with the content on the social media. Cause I know you're loving it. I've seen it. I've seen the engagement. I'm seeing the love, but I just need more. So Jam, like, I don't know what we got to do. Like, do we have to start going to people's doors, start knocking on doors, asking questions in person? Like, I don't know, but I just need people to subscribe. But everyone who has done already, we appreciate the love. And Jam, to answer your question, I'm doing great. Obviously I've got the Jamaica t-shirt on right now. You're wearing a hat.

Jamil Roberts (01:13)
We can do that mate, we can do that.

Dom Okus (01:27)
So I guess you're cold where you are. I'm on an island vibe right now, but I guess you're cold where you are. But nah, doing good, mate. Had a good weekend. And just looking forward to chatting to our guest today,

Jamil Roberts (01:38)
Yeah, lovely mate lovely good to hear and you mentioned the hat for those that are watching on YouTube I'm actually sporting the the hat here of my new club I've signed with Truro City back in back in England and the National League South so up with tinners and Anyway, let's get into the episode. So Yeah, without further ado, actually it's my pleasure to introduce a really good lad We came had the pleasure of coming across him last season when I was at Chattanooga

He's made quite a name for himself amongst usl league one and Yeah, Aaron Walker. How are you mate?

Aaron (02:16)
I'm good, I'm good. I appreciate you guys having me on. This is cool little deal you got going and I'm excited to see where it goes.

Jamil Roberts (02:24)
Ha ha ha appreciate it mate. Yeah, and I mean it goes both ways. We're excited to have you here mate and You know as I said we I Played against yourself, and you probably don't remember playing against me when I was younger You know I know you've played professional football for about 27 years now, so I'm joking

Dom Okus (02:25)
Appreciate it,

Hahaha

Aaron (02:50)
That's honestly not

Jamil Roberts (02:55)
No, but we had the we had the pleasure of spending a small amount of time together when sort of you were You were looking around to get back into the league midway through last year So I guess that's that might be a good place for us to start really in Going back to 2024 You know what? How come you didn't resign with Greenville, you know going into that 2024 season or you know, did you have offers? I know you don't have to name clubs. You don't have to sort of

go into any sort of detail, but you know, what was the reason for you just kind of taking half a season step away from the game?

Aaron (03:32)
Yeah. Good question to start. I everything happens for a reason. basically, long story short, Greenville, John Harkes, was the manager, stepped away and they decided to make a new hire. And the new hire kind of saw the team going in a different direction. And that's just the business and that's the way that it goes.

he wanted to bring in some new guys, kind of revamped the midfield. and you know, time to look elsewhere, time to start a new journey. So that's what I did. was talking to a few other clubs around the league, had some offers, tried to negotiate a little bit and then things sort of fell through at one or two different places and

I kind of ended up come late February without a club. So, it was an interesting thing for me. You know, I, I obviously wanted to keep playing. I had to, to kind of figure out, okay, maybe this is the time to, hang it up. maybe I should go into coaching, you know, all, all types of different things went into my, into my head. but there was something that wasn't

I wasn't ready to give it up just yet. So I kept training, started actually training with Atlanta United too, just to stay fit, work a bit and see if anything could pop up. Cause it felt like clubs were kind of knocking at the door, but not really having anything substantial to offer me. So it was like, you know, bread crumbings, not a great word, but I just felt like something was right there for a couple of months, you know, so.

Jamil Roberts (05:27)
Yeah, yeah.

Aaron (05:30)
I was like, I gotta keep going, gotta see what I can do here. And then met you at Chattanooga. Ian called me here at Tormenta and said, you know, we feel like we're missing someone like you. And I got a really good vibe from him. So ended up coming here towards the end of 2024. We didn't have the best stretch of games when I was here, but

I really believe in Ian and what he's doing and that's why I wanted to come back here for 2025. So a bit of an interesting year in 2024 for me, like just trying to stay fit, especially at my age, just a bit of a whirlwind. But now, like I said, I feel like things happen for a reason and I'm very happy with where I'm at.

Jamil Roberts (06:19)
Mate that's quality and you know I'm happy you're in a place now. You know that you feel like you can start kicking on again you Did you did you play in TST in the summer?

Aaron (06:32)
I did, yeah. I learned that out. Yeah, that was so much fun. believe it was 2017 is when I played for FC Cincinnati and USL. And one of the guys that played for that team, Mike Malay, put the team together for Natty. So was all these older guys that used to play for Natty and just...

Jamil Roberts (06:33)
Yeah, how is that?

Aaron (06:56)
Quality quality dudes like it's such good people. It was so much fun. We we didn't have a great tournament I think I think a lot of guys were like, this will be alright and and it you know, we kind of got put into a tough group and bounced early but Insanity we had reggae Rovers who I think made it pretty far Either the final or the semi-final I can't

Jamil Roberts (07:12)
who was in that group.

They made the final, I think, didn't they?

Yeah, definitely,

Elise Semi. I remember watching.

Aaron (07:25)
We had Burnley, which was JJ Watt's team. They weren't great, but it was cool playing against JJ Watt. I think the highlight of my career actually is I remember turning him and he kind of slipped and fell in one of the games. I just was like, there's no way I just did that. I wish they had the clip, but I got to find it. It was unbelievable. This guy is, I mean, everybody's like, he's big, he's big, but.

Dom Okus (07:44)
Hahaha!

Jamil Roberts (07:49)
We can find it.

Dom Okus (07:50)
Mm-hmm.

Aaron (07:55)
Until you see those people up close, is ridiculous. Like I'm looking straight up at a refrigerator.

Jamil Roberts (07:58)
like big dude.

Aaron (08:07)
It's ridiculous. And then the other team we played was, it was a good team as well. I can't remember, but they advanced out of the group. I can't remember the team, but they also were very good. But overall, just insane experience. I'm kind of disappointed. Can't do it.

Jamil Roberts (08:28)
It's mad how big it's become in there like

Dom like do you keep up with it when it's on?

Dom Okus (08:33)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I see Stag United went, was it this year, last year? They went, I know they're like a big YouTube and other non-league. The Como team played, I know if it was this last year or the team before, but they went, I Fabregas played one of these, one of the years. So yes, Big Man is sick. It's like even all the content they do around it is like sick.

Jamil Roberts (08:39)
Mmm.

Aaron (08:47)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (08:54)
Yeah, my old club Plumifargal back in England, like they've got a team going into it this year is the reach that it's got is crazy at this point like Yeah, remember obviously you met Gustavo, didn't you? When you came into and he was at NCFC the year the first year of TST and he said like they got free tickets to every single game and he like he said firsthand like it's unbelievable that like

Dom Okus (09:02)
Yeah, it's crazy.

Aaron (09:08)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (09:23)
Watching it on TV is fun, but actually it's such a different experience. You can see why it's so popular. It's like a big party. And obviously you played in it, Aaron. It must have been so cool looking around. Nanny's over there, for example. Some of these bigger teams bringing in...

I don't know, just A-listers to come and play in it. Like, it's such a w- It's such a different, weird vibe that I just think it's so- looks so fun from the outside. Like, why people, like, are drawn to it.

Aaron (09:56)
Yeah, it's nuts. Like seeing every year more and more celebrities are involved and it just meshes like so many like walks of life and like people you've played with when, when you were a youth, people who are NFL players, like we obviously didn't mention Ocho Cinco was on our team. So it was like, he was on our team and this guy is insane. He's like one of the coolest people ever. Like so down to earth, like drove, like drove us around.

Jamil Roberts (10:16)
Yeah.

Aaron (10:26)
Just humble. He's just like everything that people says he is. He's the man and he's a freak athlete still at his age. Like we're doing crossing and finishing and the guy's jumping, like clearing the goal. I'm just like, what's going on here? It's mad.

Dom Okus (10:42)
Madness.

Jamil Roberts (10:43)
What was his

tech like though, be honest.

Dom Okus (10:47)
Yeah, yeah. The silence is definite. Silence is definite. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Say no more. Say no more.

Jamil Roberts (10:51)
Hehehehehe

Aaron (10:55)
He

would pull some stuff out now and again. like he he's a big soccer guy. Like he loves FIFA people that know he's a huge FIFA guy and he loves watching the game and he could pull some stuff out for sure. top guy and the tournament is there's such a buzz around it like in person. It's crazy. Like you said watching it on TV is one thing but when you're there it's there's such a buzz around the grounds. That's it's so cool.

Dom Okus (11:02)
Yeah.

Yep.

Jamil Roberts (11:10)
I love it.

I think it's only gonna get bigger as well in it But yeah, that's something I'd love to do as well there's There was like a route. There's a room. Obviously is held in Kerry, North Carolina And that's where my my college team won the national championship So there's like always Like a basically there was a rumor one year and I don't know how true it is But who's the dude that does the college game day? It's like is it Pat McCaffey? Is that his name?

Aaron (11:54)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (11:55)
So Pat McAfee is a big... Right, okay, yeah. So obviously he's a big... He's a big WVU fan. And obviously West Virginia University and Marshall University, like two powerhouses now in college soccer. So there's rumors flying around every year that Pat McAfee wants to like create like a West Virginia like all-star team to like go to it. And listen Pat, like I'm ready.

Aaron (11:57)
How was the other team in our group? Thank you.

Jamil Roberts (12:25)
I'm ready to go, like, just because I'm not on US soil, like, the tanners are keeping me fit, like, I'm ready to go.

Aaron (12:33)
I was gonna say, it seems like a storybook for you to get back there. You played there when you were at Marshall, right? Played there when you were Marshall and I think you need to get back there. I know your current club situation is gonna be tough but maybe in that, it'd be a shame for you to pull up with a hammy for a couple weeks around that time.

Jamil Roberts (12:42)
Yeah. Yeah.

Aw, it would

be awful, wouldn't it? Yeah. Between the mumps of, you know, yeah.

Aaron (13:02)
I have a flight to North Carolina to do my rehab.

Dom Okus (13:06)
What's this?

Jamil Roberts (13:09)
Specialist right I love it. I'll just keep that one in the calendar All right, anyway, I think well just just bringing it back to you for a second so obviously we kind of touched on 2024 and you know Kind of the difficulty of like almost basically almost call a spade a spade, you know almost dropped falling out of the game you know, and you knew deep down that it wasn't for you and

Aaron (13:14)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (13:36)
You you touched on the uh Kind of the end of 2024 and how much you enjoyed that experience and you know sort of just looking ahead to 2025 now You know, yes You're back with tormentor But you're in a different role now. You're in that player coaching role, you know, we've both played under ian

You know, what does that... Has that dynamic changed between the two of you? Now you've gone from kind of a senior player to actually, you know, on the staff or, you know, is it kind of business as usual and you're just getting drip-fed new responsibilities and learning as you go, you know, how does that sort of dynamic work?

Aaron (14:17)
Yeah, it's very much the, the ladder. He's, I would say that the relationship's still the same, just kind of drip fed, you know, new responsibilities and roles. I wanted to have something to all, you know, I'm, doing my B license right now, so I can kind of learn a lot this year. At the end of the year, I'll have my B license and then I'll know, yeah, like this is kind of something I want to pursue or not. And like, like I said,

the dynamic between us is still the same. I only got to work with him for three months last year, but what I really, really enjoyed was how much he valued my opinion. know, he knows, you know, I've been around the game for, like you said, about 27 years pro. So he, it's nice to have, him, you know, value my opinion and have my input taken into consideration. And so that was kind of the thought is like, look, you can help.

with a lot of different roles, responsibilities, player coach, help plan trainings, help break down film, help do things just to be another resource and another voice to back the staff too. So I'm really excited for how this is gonna play out. I think we've brought in a really talented group here this year and kind of being that like gap between coach and players. It's a unique role, because obviously,

I have to be with the coaches side and then the players start to feel a certain type of way. I gotta have the players back. it's a bit of a balance, but nonetheless, I'm really excited for it.

Dom Okus (15:59)
Do you think the players see you as a coach or do they see you as one of the lads?

Aaron (16:06)
That's the tough part. So I'm trying to do both because obviously, as you all know, these are long seasons and tensions can ride high up and down throughout the year. So I got to have the backs of both of them. But it's a fun balance. It's something I'm navigating. And at the end of the day, we all want what's best for the team and we all want to be successful. So we're to do our best to put that foot forward.

Jamil Roberts (16:08)
Hahaha

Aaron (16:36)
very much learn as I go. So I'm like I said, it's exciting, but we'll see.

Jamil Roberts (16:44)
i like it may i like how diplomatic you are feel like i certainly can imagine being in that torment a chain room and so now in you know ian he's he can is mood can change by the second and that he won't mind me saying that you know he's lost his rag of me many a time in the past and he's also he's also probably giving me you know the top five top five

Aaron (17:04)
Yeah

Jamil Roberts (17:13)
tightest hugs of his life so you know we've seen both sides of our relationship I feel like there's an opportunity for you there mate that when he loses his head you just sort of go put your arm around that lad and be like don't worry mate I've got you like I'll look after you don't you? One of them ones didn't it mate?

Aaron (17:29)
smooth it over as best I can.

Jamil Roberts (17:31)
Yeah, yeah.

Step into the office. Fucking prick, isn't he? Not Ian Bonoay, I wasn't calling Ian a prick. I love Ian Cameron, I love him to death. Did he uh... We had a funny little spat, actually, when we played Tormentor at home this season. Where me and him got into it at half time and then I ended up scoring in the second half and I was giving it back to whatever and...

Dom Okus (17:35)
Mmph.

Aaron (17:35)
Yeah.

Exactly.

Jamil Roberts (17:59)
I saw him at the end of the game and I genuinely like all across the line was like why was I arguing with this bloke like I I love Ian I'll always love Ian I loved working under him we achieved something brilliant together and it was just like I don't know tensions ran high on that one particular day or one particular evening but like with the one thing with Ian that you can always rely on is that it gets left on the pitch right like you don't I don't think he's one to kind of hold the grudge after and he's a really good human being so definitely someone that you like

Aaron (17:59)
You really

Jamil Roberts (18:29)
you know firsthand, like you're gonna learn so much from in a coaching perspective as well, aren't you?

Aaron (18:34)
Yeah, yeah. Like you said, when all's and done, he's very good about leaving it on the pitch. And there's a lot of things that I've learned from him in just a short amount of time. And he's still a young manager, mind you. You know what I mean? Like, it's crazy that. I don't know. Just said. Got to be real. But no, it's.

Jamil Roberts (18:49)
Yeah, yeah. A few more grays nowadays, but... Sorry, it's the last one. Ian, I love you. Sorry.

Dom Okus (18:53)
Hahaha

Okay

Aaron (19:04)
It's cool to learn from him because he's I feel like he's got all he's very passionate and he's very smart, tactically sound, and I think pretty advanced for his age and the way that he commands, you know, a locker room. And I think there's an art to that. And I think it's not easy to do at that age. So that's pretty good.

Jamil Roberts (19:25)
100 %

one thing that I think every player who's worked under him and

I haven't heard many too dissimilar is how good he is actually on the training ground I feel like in terms of usl coaches like in terms of sessions day to day I don't think anyone's come close and then like his level of like how meticulous he is with his analysis and breakdown of teams and

He's one of those coaches that for me, like when he said like, this is how we're going to win the game. Like I firmly believed that like there and then, and you know, some coaches, they can go over film and you sort of just go like, yeah, we're just going to play and see what happens. but when like he's very deliberate and meticulous in that process, I think that's one of the most impressive things about him. You know, like, is there anything that kind of sticks out to you? Like that you've sort of picked up already, for example.

Aaron (20:18)
Yeah, I think that's a very, very good point. Like that's something I would point out is like when you, he's very smart, very meticulous. And when he has a plan, he has a plan. And I think he, what I really, really respect is that he's willing to live by the sword and die by the sword. Like if he's like, look, this is how we're going to play. We're going to press. It might not come off, but I was a player once I want football to be enjoyable.

I want you to work hard. It's not always going to be perfect. How can we manage it? But when he has a plan, he makes you believe in that plan, which I think is, is there's something to be said about that for sure. and like I said, he does a really good job of commanding a locker room and commanding the floor. When he speaks, he makes you feel it. And on the training ground, like he's, he's very good equal parts, you know, pushing you.

but also has banter, he can lighten the room when need be. I don't know how it was when you were here, but obviously he's got more experience now. I think he's found from what I'm seeing, obviously I have a limited time with him, but from what I'm seeing, he's got a very good balance and a very good foothold on who he's starting to become as a manager, which is cool.

Jamil Roberts (21:18)
Yeah.

Yeah 100 % me and you sort of touched on the the squad there that you build in and you know We won't go through it, but you know you've got my boy Gabriel down there Gabriel Alves. That's my boy from Marshall. He's We yeah, he played left-back behind me in that Marshall team the one the national title, so yeah, he's Yeah, yeah, yeah, well that was when I was I was actually quick back then now I can't move

Aaron (21:54)
Is it?

I forgot you were a winger at one point.

Dom Okus (22:09)
And you played a bit of sh- and you played up top a little bit is what I thought, is that right?

Aaron (22:10)
Amen. Trust me.

Jamil Roberts (22:14)
Yeah,

I actually played up top in the national championship final and scored.

Dom Okus (22:18)
Yeah, that near.

Aaron (22:21)
It's that easy. That's what every defender thinks too.

Jamil Roberts (22:24)
I know right?

And yeah, now I shout head kick and just kick the ball in the box.

Aaron (22:31)
Head kick.

Dom Okus (22:32)
You reckon? Nah mate, I reckon if I break into a sprint my Achilles is gonna tear. You know what I'm saying, I might as try to sprint now. Nah, I'm done man. I've been at the game now since what? Like, since college pretty much, like at a higher level so, yeah nah, I'm just on this gym thing. Just lifting weights, bit of running, that's it man. Like sprinting now, I'm scared. I'm actually scared, if I sprint my Achilles might go.

Jamil Roberts (22:34)
Dom you've got more movement than me nowadays

Aaron (22:53)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (22:53)
you

Aaron (23:01)
I'm

Dom Okus (23:01)
I

Aaron (23:01)
scared so I don't know how you feel.

Jamil Roberts (23:03)
You

Dom Okus (23:04)
actually had a question for you. As a player coach, what are your expectations from a playing perspective? Are you just kind of mostly focusing on the coaching side of filling in as a player as needed? Or are you trying to play every minute of every game? What's that kind of balance like for you?

Aaron (23:05)
I'm still in the womb and I'm scared.

Yeah, that's a good one. I, I'm very much still a player in my head. I want to play as much as I possibly can. Obviously with age comes, you know, you have to be a little smarter. but I still feel like I'm in very good shape and want to keep, keep pushing as much as I can to be on the field. Cause obviously at the end of the day, I like having a feel and a say of like what happens. So,

very much a player, but I'm okay with stepping back at times if need be and putting on that other hat. And that's part of the balance that I'm learning right now. So it's interesting. It's still pre-season and I feel like I'm getting little nuggets every day. So it's cool.

Dom Okus (24:13)
So how are you going to deal with the situation that's inevitably going to come where you have to tell a player, not only are you not playing, but I'm playing instead of you.

Jamil Roberts (24:24)
I would lose my head if you

said that to me

Aaron (24:29)
And that would be okay. Yeah, that's an interesting one. It's something I've thought about, at the end of the day, you know, it's, I will say, regardless of what it is, it's team first. And, and, you know, I've done my time. So if I feel like the team needs me, that's, that's just what, what's going to happen. no jokes aside, it's.

Dom Okus (24:31)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (24:31)
You

Dom Okus (24:36)
You

Jamil Roberts (24:44)
Yeah. Yeah.

Dom Okus (24:53)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.

Aaron (24:56)
There's an art to being able to manage players and not that I'm at that level yet by any means, but like there's you see some of these older player or older managers like in the way that they go about managing from top to bottom, like being able to put your arm around certain guys and hey, like still get the best out of them without losing them. And there's, there's a real art to that. And I think there's it's, it's processes that you continue to learn. Like I said, I keep saying that, like,

I don't have all the answers now. I'd be lying if I said I did. So I'm just still trying to learn along the way and kind of store everything that I can.

Dom Okus (25:34)
Yeah, yeah, 100%. I definitely think it's all in the delivery, right, and how you communicate. I remember college, it was the year we won the conference. We're playing against our biggest rivals, Charleston, Jamil, that you'll be familiar with. I'm flying all season, playing great. And I've been dropped for that game. It's kind of out of nowhere. Been told maybe half an hour before we got out for the warm-up.

Jamil Roberts (25:48)
Mm-hmm.

Dom Okus (26:01)
And the way it's been done is the assistant's been sent to basically tell me that I'm not playing. He's like, Dom, can I chat to you outside? Never chat to me before the game, never. Dom's gonna go outside. He's like, yeah, we're not starting you today, you're on the bench. And my head's just gone. So I'm in the warm up. You know when you're serving and bollying? I'm just bollying the ball away. I'm being an absolute brat. I'm just letting the ball...

Aaron (26:11)
See you

Jamil Roberts (26:22)
Ha ha!

Toxic you are you're toxic

Aaron (26:26)
Yeah.

Dom Okus (26:30)
I'm just letting the ball hit me, like they're feeding it to me like it's fire volley and I'm just letting it hit me and like it's just p-rolling. And then the vice captain, my boy Paul, who you met as well, John, he just pulled me. He just pulled me and been like, fucking talk yourself out. Like this is the big game of the season, like stop being a brat. And I was like, yeah, fair, fair, fair enough. And then it was fine, we ended up drawing the game, 0-0. Good result for us. It was fine.

Aaron (26:33)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (26:41)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Aaron (26:48)
Yeah. Yeah.

Dom Okus (26:58)
But yeah, if it was just the way it was delivered, I wish the gaffer would have come to me and been like, look, you've been great all season. We want to do something different today. We think we're going to be like mostly defending kind of low block. And we think this guy will be better for that. Maybe better in the air, whatever. So you're going to be on the bench. I'd have been like, cool, no problem. But it's kind of just that little rush. Yeah, sorry, we're not going to play. Gaffer said nothing to me. Doesn't say anything in the warm up. And I'm just like, come on. I think we've got a better relationship than that, you know?

Aaron (27:13)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (27:23)
Yeah,

it's always such a tough one in it. Like you said the delivery is so important with it You know, like at the end of the day, no one likes being told that they're being left out But there's just a way to like limit the damage there, right? Like it's down. It is really damaged limitation and like there's a way to go about it and I feel like especially like Not so much the newer school of players I do think there's a newer generation of footballer now that has a different outlook on

Aaron (27:24)
You're not the...

Dom Okus (27:39)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (27:53)
Maybe like not as confrontational or doesn't necessarily need but like you said Aaron before like, you know, it's it's Learning that art of how to communicate that to to different members of the locker room But certainly for like I feel like the it's a dying or I guess like more senior Members of every locker room like especially at the professional level

very minimum like you expect a conversation right like you know what you know tell me why I'm not playing if I've been playing regularly what am I all of a sudden not doing to not be out there to do the job like I'm sure those are challenges you're gonna you're gonna face Aaron do you know what I mean I'm sure you're buzzing for them as well

Dom Okus (28:35)
hahahaha

Aaron (28:36)
Yeah.

Well, there's an art to it, man. Like being able to let people know where they stand and being straight up and honest and still being respected and liked as a manager. You know, obviously not a manager, but like you see there's guys in the world that are like that. Like, I feel like I don't, I don't know how some of these guys are like an enchilada or Mourinho.

But like on the inside, they still get the best out of their guys. While what I feel like I see is they know the guys know where they stand. And I think there's there's such a, there's such a, it's such a difficult thing and there's a way to go about it. But when a manager is straight up with you, like honestly, honesty upfront is tells you why you're not in the squad. There's nothing you can do but respect it. And if he says that first thing, yeah, you take it all day.

Jamil Roberts (29:27)
You would yeah, you take that all day long as well, don't you?

One thing that always like that just came into my head and it'll always when we talk about man management and we talk about this and that it's when Gary never always used to say like he would go like Sir Alex Ferguson would go up to members of the United team at that time and like the peak era and obviously all the you know times he rebuilt and you know title-winning teams and he would tell players like listen like you're not in you're not even in the squad today because I need you in a three weeks time

And somehow he would say it in a way where like the player would walk away and be like he feel felt important like he goes like like three week I'm do everything to be fucking spot like 100 % in three weeks time when in reality He's just gone like I don't need you for three weeks, man How does that happen?

Aaron (30:08)
Yes.

Dom Okus (30:19)
Ha!

Aaron (30:23)
It's an art to it a hundred percent and you touched on it too like it's a different day and age now where like I Don't know if I'm totally accurate here, but it's a it's a more sensitive era like it's guys back then I think just the way that People are now it's with like everything just so instant gratification that like when they're told no

Dom Okus (30:24)
No. No.

Jamil Roberts (30:38)
Absolutely.

Aaron (30:50)
It's like, what such a shock and it used to be a lot more ruthless back then. So they're really now they're even there's even more like emphasis on how you can keep the group belief from top to bottom, keep guys on board mentally. It's it's even harder now.

Jamil Roberts (31:07)
Yeah, and that goes both ways like being a coach but also being a player like I mean I've experienced it and Dom I don't know if you experienced it like when you know you were Playing in your college days, but like I mean There's just things you can say That you sorry you cut sorry there's things that you can't say anymore that you did when you were you know It's little as honestly as little as four to five years ago, you know things you can do

to other people in a locker room, pranks, know, a bit of banter here and there. The world is changing and football is changing along with it, right? So not only from a coach's perspective, but a teammate's perspective, you just have to be so careful in the way that you deliver things, especially to the younger generation, like you said. Yeah, it's, I don't know.

Aaron (31:39)
Thanks.

Jamil Roberts (32:07)
call me old school i mean i'm twenty six i'm not old school whatsoever like i would take my foot what bringing over this current crops every single day of the week i mean i feel like it shaped who i am as a person i know dom you've you've you grew up playing in england the same way that i do like you know it's a different world in it

Dom Okus (32:29)
Yeah, I

think what's happened is the world's just changed. It's not a football thing, it's just a reflection of society, right? I think there's been more protection, there's been more speak about how you communicate with other people and what you do and what you're allowed to say and not say, and then that's just creeped into football naturally, But I completely agree you. I feel like we're seeing it, right? And the externality of that is that I just don't feel we've got as good players as we did before.

because of this, because of this kind of just like, oh, just leave him alone and don't tackle this person hard in training and don't make them be humble and wash the boots and all of that stuff that the previous generation had to do. It's now you've got a player who's maybe 17, 18 comes out as on fire and then 22, 23, they're off playing in Saudi Arabia or something. So yeah, I definitely think it's just a change. And like, I don't know, I often feel like these things come in cycles.

So maybe we'll go back to what we were doing before for the next generation, know, maybe in 10, 15 years it will come full circle. Maybe that's what you're thinking. I don't know. But when I have children, I'm going to bring them up in a sporting environment the same way I did. So, yeah, I guess we'll see. I guess we'll see.

Aaron (33:45)
It makes the reward that much sweeter when you have to work for it a little more. You know what I mean? You're saying that it's like having to watch the first team guys' boots and having to go through the trials and tribulations when you're in academies. It was tougher. It was tougher upbringing. And then you get to that first team and you're like, my god, I made it. And now things are just given.

Jamil Roberts (33:52)
100 %

Dom Okus (33:52)
100%.

Jamil Roberts (33:56)
Ahem.

Dom Okus (34:10)
Yeah.

Aaron (34:13)
And it's just call it what it is, know, it's the changing of the world, whatever we people use the term soft people. It is what it is. Like I said, you know, it's a it's an interesting time. It's a critical time for footballers and you're seeing definitely a different a different era. But I definitely wish these things came in cycles in terms of the the way.

Dom Okus (34:22)
Yeah.

Aaron (34:42)
the way it was played because we're not seeing, I had a conversation about this with somebody the other day. We're not seeing the goals we used to see in the game. Think about some of the goals you used to see. Just like the creativity and it's crazy.

Jamil Roberts (34:51)
man.

like it

Just the,

like the, I dunno, I feel like it, there's one player that this season that I've seen play football that embodies it and he's now fucked off to Saudi so it doesn't fucking matter anymore but John, like, Juran, yeah, like, for me he was like the only person that I watched this season in the Premier League, like, Cole Palmer's had that in the past, like, the, you last season and whatnot but he was just that person that just went fuck it, like, and just hit it from 40 yards and it flew in.

Aaron (35:12)
the

Dom Okus (35:25)
Yes.

Jamil Roberts (35:26)
How many

times you see someone score from 40 yards nowadays? It's hardly ever, is it? Is that down to like... Do you think that's down to coaches? Like being very strict and, you know, so system-based nowadays? Or do you think that's down to the personality of the players though? Because I think it can go both ways, right?

Aaron (35:30)
Yeah, totally.

Dom Okus (35:47)
think it's the coaching. I think in academy, you've got under 12s, 13s, 14s who are talking about low blocks. And I'm like, we was talking about none of that. It was like basic drills, you know, little bit of shake. Yeah, little bit of shake. But like lot of the time you spend in the last 30 minutes of training just go and play. And like the coach would definitely stop it and be like, All right, this is what you should have done in this passage and whatnot. But it was very like go much and go and play and like.

Aaron (35:55)
Mm-hmm.

Jamil Roberts (35:56)
Yeah.

It was about nutmegs and and yeah

Yeah.

Dom Okus (36:15)
Play off your instincts, know? Get at someone, what, do all of it. Now it's like, this is the pattern of play. The goalkeeper has the ball, you pass it to the left back to centre mid, checks it and he drops it to the other centre, we spread it to the, it's like, at 12 or 13, why are you doing that? And like, you've got, you've got like five years later down the line when you're really getting closer to men's football where you can learn like structures and patterns of playing all that stuff. But as a kid, just express yourself, like have fun. But there's not many players now that you see that are like just going and expressing themselves. Everything is like really like structured and.

Aaron (36:28)
Yeah.

Dom Okus (36:45)
Perfect, but it's making it boring. It's making the game boring. It's so boring. Yeah

Jamil Roberts (36:48)
Yeah

Aaron (36:49)
Very rigid. Very rigid. It's like we

every even U11, U12 teams are trying to be like 2022 city, you know, it's like we're not we're not here to create like perfect patterns like that. Like go go have fun. Express yourself. Obviously you have some tactics, but it's it feels like the creativity of the game is just being sucked out. And it sounds bad to say it's like I would love to get back to a point where

Dom Okus (37:00)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (37:00)
Yeah!

Dom Okus (37:14)
100%.

Jamil Roberts (37:15)
Yeah.

Aaron (37:19)
Obviously tactics are super important, like where guys take a couple guys on and just pull one from 35 yards out. You know, I always think of that like, I always think of that CSA goal, the Newcastle goal against.

Dom Okus (37:33)
Mmm, the

bend, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Aaron (37:36)
But you never see goals like that anymore. I don't know why you just-

Jamil Roberts (37:38)
What right have you got to

score from there? like, you know what I mean? It's really like, if you don't buy a ticket, you don't win the raffle.

Dom Okus (37:40)
Yes.

No.

Aaron (37:45)
Yeah,

nobody is shooting that nowadays. Guys are taking that down, trying to combine one, two, walk the ball into the net. like, it's just, doesn't happen.

Jamil Roberts (37:54)
Yeah,

like and you think about like for example The the way moon rate Wayne Rooney's volley that he scored against Newcastle earlier in his career and And he said the only reason I hit it was because I was so pissed off from speaking to the ref I should have got a foul 30 seconds earlier that I just put my foot through the ball. Do you know I mean like I just don't like

Dom Okus (38:05)
yeah.

Aaron (38:10)
Yeah.

Dom Okus (38:10)
To the rest.

Jamil Roberts (38:18)
That thought process doesn't go through a modern footballer's head, does it? Like you said, bring it down, maybe secure it, and then we can play in this area. He just thought, fuck it, and he's gone top corner. man. Yeah, I feel like that's a topic that we could go round and round in circles on all day because it is something that I miss from football, and I'm sure... What was it?

Aaron (38:32)
smashed it. Yeah. It's crazy.

Dom Okus (38:35)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (38:47)
Prime Barclays, that's the Twitter saying it's on it, Prime Barclays. Listen, there's one more topic that I think we wouldn't be having Aaron Walker on the show that I wanna just kinda touch on without diving into this topic a little bit, and that is your time at Greenville. Obviously, 131 appearances, wearing the armband, winning a title, just kind of, it was a...

Dom Okus (38:49)
Yeah, the hashtag. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jamil Roberts (39:17)
At the end of the day, genuinely, my time when I came into League One and whatever, like, I associated Greenville Triumph with, like, John Harks, Aaron Walker, Lucas Coutinho, Don Smart, you know, Evan Lee, Polak, you know, these players, like, that really built Greenville Triumph from the ground up. you know.

What kind of everlasting impact has that club had on your life? And you know, just kind of talk to us a little bit about your time at the club there and how much you enjoyed it.

Aaron (39:53)
Yeah, it was very special to me. Big, big time family feel club. Very, very like a huge impetus on, you know, community club family, like being a tight knit group from top to bottom front office players, staff. And that's the vision that John had when he came to Greenville and the

The thing that sticks out to me above, you know, the titles and getting to the playoffs every year and all those things is like the, the culture can really drive everything. think that's something that like the culture was established from day one, having been there from the start and guys bought in and you can go so far with that. You can, you really like at this level.

more so than probably the highest of levels. But at this level, if you have, you know, a culture in place and people buy in and, you know, practice the things that John tried to instill in us with servant leadership and team first mentality and putting others before yourself. And like, it sounds all like cliches, but when you see it come to life and you see it actually work, you're like, wow, like this is something you can really believe in.

That for me was something that I take away. I mean, it felt like home to me. I'm from Atlanta, but Greenville totally felt like home, somewhere I could end up staying and definitely learned a ton in that club and just special times really.

Jamil Roberts (41:43)
I love that man. I love that and I think you can You could feel that from the outside as well like especially I've You I mean you can you have your own opinion and whatnot But I feel like even the old ground right like it was so like the it was always packed whenever I went to play Greenville away It was close to the pitch like I really felt like it was a tough place to go

You know, and you compare that now with the direction they've gone with, you know, playing in the new stadium and whatnot. just don't feel like it has yet to find that formula that you guys had, you know, that led you to so much success. You know, I always forget this, but obviously, Clausey was part of your team where you won the title. So, Clausey was actually part of Vertex Soccer, who I work for now.

Dom Okus (42:15)
their care.

Jamil Roberts (42:41)
He's actually one of the main reasons why I ended up in America in the first place. Yeah, it's a small world.

Aaron (42:41)
Yeah.

crazy. Yeah, Paul's a good friend of mine.

He's a good friend of mine. like I was funny story actually. Paul 2019, the very first year of Greenville.

we go to preseason down to IMG, you know, which for a league one club, John was like, look, we're going to have this standard, this standard. obviously they learned after that year that the budget is a little bit tighter than they thought. we never, we never went to IMG again, but, but I get down there. obviously I'm a center mid Paul's a center mid. We get down there.

Dom Okus (43:16)
Just

Jamil Roberts (43:17)
Ha

Aaron (43:28)
They're like, Hey, you know, your roommate, he's coming in late. He'll be in like a day or two later. Um, but he's a center mid he's from England. His name is Paul Clowes. Um, you'll, you'll like him. He's a sound guy and he comes in, I think it's a second day. Maybe I could be completely wrong. This was a long time ago, but he comes in, he comes in from England to IMG very late, like late in the middle of night and I'm asleep already. He comes in, I don't hear him.

And then at like three or three 30, I always tell this story. Paul, it's so funny. He, I hear like this, crumbling of like, like a rapper. I'm like, what is that noise? I wake up, I, I, it's pitch black. I don't see anything. I just hear somebody like a rapper and I hear somebody eating. I'm like, it's three 30 in the morning. What's going on here? Don't think anything of it. Wake up the next day. We go train, have the normal day that you do down there to a day or whatever it is next night.

We go to bed, 3.30, 4 a.m. I hear a rapper again, same sound, just eating rapper. I'm like, what is going on? The next morning I'm like, did you hear anything last night, like in the middle of the night? And he's like, yeah, mate, sorry, I forgot to tell you. I have a granola bar at like 3.30 every night. Like I wake up starving in the middle of the night. And he just would, every night, like, yeah, it was like my first time meeting him. And I was like, this guy is weird, man. What is going

Jamil Roberts (44:51)
What?

Aaron (44:58)
long story short, ends up, I don't think it says he wakes up in the middle of the night starving and he's eating these granola bars and the first couple nights, I obviously don't know the guy, so I'm like, I don't really say anything much to him, but I'm like talking to the teammates and I'm like, this new guy's eating granola bars all the night, waking me up, like what are we doing? Getting nature valley crumbs all in his bed. I'm like, guy's a psychopath.

Jamil Roberts (44:59)
What does he set an alarm or like

Dom Okus (45:01)
Thank you.

Turn it off.

Hehehe!

Jamil Roberts (45:24)
It's like a fucking gerbil just like storing

it

Aaron (45:28)
He's a psychopath and then fast forward a couple years and I'm at his wedding, we're like this. mean, Paul is a really good friend of mine. I've hung out with him and I know Kat super well and their son, George, they're so close to me. So it's funny. Greenville, like that was just how it was. Guys got very tight. So.

Dom Okus (45:32)
Peace.

Jamil Roberts (45:51)
That's a funny story, I've met a funny enough he's never told me that one so So I love to I love to ask you about that off the off camera as well. But no, I think I think you talked about there like obviously That family feel and and what not that you create down in Greenville and you know, it resulted in a title as well So, you know, know I know how like special that feeling is and you

Dom Okus (46:01)
you

Jamil Roberts (46:21)
Also brought the first one to Greenville. It was a it was a weird one, right? Because you it was a like you didn't play the final if I remember rightly Like you know what what was kind of the dynamic there? Was it like a Covid related thing?

Aaron (46:37)
Yeah, 2020, that was a strange, strange year. we had um, I believe it was 2020. Yeah. I mean, it was during COVID we short in season. Um, I believe it was 16 games. Like again, it's a blur, but, um, we, we, we were in first place going into what was going to be the final against Omaha and that we could.

Jamil Roberts (47:03)
You were ahead

by a while as well weren't you, like you were far and away first.

Aaron (47:08)
Yeah, we, that is one thing where like kind of feels justified because we, started the year and just took off and we were up there the whole year, had an incredible year, just so solid. And we were going to play Omaha in the final and that week of training leading up, was obviously like, you know, tents and the day, I think it was the day before we were going to leave. No, the day before we were going to play, we, we were at training and

you know, it's a little tense, like I said, and then we're doing our last, I believe it's like our last exercise. We were about to play maybe a small sighted or patterns of play or something right before we, we go back into the locker room and the staff kind of gets together and has like a quick chat and the mood just changed like instantly. It was like, like what's going on here? And like, we're like, all right, so let's do some patterns of play. Like they were just so loose, like so excited and we're like, what's going on here? Like,

And we'd finished our patterns of play. And then they like, I can't quite remember, but they brought us in and they told us like, essentially, I guess the Omaha team had come down with, with a bad outbreak of COVID and that the league decided to, to cancel the final and just award us the trophy. Cause it was such a strange time. Like at that time was the height of COVID. So they weren't going to make the trip. Obviously couldn't fly all the end market. Like all that stuff was such a complicated thing. So the league was like, look,

they won the league, we're going to give them the trophy. And they told us at training, was, it was crazy. It was scenes like we had the days, the day before training or the day before our games, we drive to the stadium field to train on the stadium field. We were normally on the training facilities grass, but we drove, you drive to turf kind of the day before, get used to it. And then, so it's like a 10 minute drive back to the locker room. We drive back, everybody's stopping at the gas station, getting

Jamil Roberts (48:44)
you

Ha

ha ha ha!

Aaron (49:08)
Adult beverages,

we go into the locker room and it's just like, was pandemonium champagne. Like they had taped up the locker room. People are going crazy. I mean, was like, what did this, did this really just happen? Because it felt so like strange celebrating it. Cause we didn't really play the final, but at the same time with the year that we had, how we just took off and stayed up there, it felt like, okay, like this was well-deserved. So yeah, it was crazy, but it was sweet.

Jamil Roberts (49:37)
I thought I was really hoping you were gonna come out with something like yeah Harksy went inside and just came out with a fucking two to 30 racks in each hand and said we've done it boys

Dom Okus (49:45)
No.

Aaron (49:49)
Yeah, that's

basically what happened.

Jamil Roberts (49:52)
That's so sick mate, you know that I mean obviously the achievements are achievements not true, you know not comparing to however It reminds me like the videos of like, you know, you see like the Leicester players Like obviously it was one out of their hands, you know, I mean, that's what that sort of feels like, know You were waiting for something to happen and then it just got handed to you right like handed to in quotations because like you said you are far and away the best team but like

Aaron (49:54)
last week.

Dom Okus (50:05)
and

Aaron (50:15)
Yeah. Right.

Jamil Roberts (50:21)
Yeah, I it was scenes, mate. I it was unbelievable. It was on that Omaha team, Dom. I remember all this happening. Yeah, I think was Ilaos' flatmate, and there was three of the lads, or four players were in one flat, and one of them got COVID, which is that funny time where if one gets it, automatically four players are written off. It was just, yeah, it one of those. But, I bet that was a crazy day. I bet that's one you'll never forget for the rest of your life, eh?

Dom Okus (50:29)
Right.

Well...

Aaron (50:51)
Yeah, it was it was wild. We did like I think the next day because obviously fans had planned on doing the final and coming to the final. They did like a mock final. So we had like it was like an inner squad. People were just like having a good time joking around. It felt like what you'd see is like a normal like all star game. Now we're guys just, you know, they're running around having fun. were into it pretty much. Yeah, yeah.

Jamil Roberts (51:16)
and a half pester what?

Dom Okus (51:20)
Yeah

Jamil Roberts (51:20)
You

Aaron (51:21)
Yeah, you know how it goes. So it was all laughs. But at the end of it, we got to lift the trophy and proper celebrate even more than we did the night before. So it was just a sick, sick weekend.

Dom Okus (51:25)
No.

sick sick sick yeah man

Jamil Roberts (51:40)
That's so

cool. That's just unique in it. we want it in 90 minutes. It seems fucking boring.

Aaron (51:44)
It It was.

Dom Okus (51:49)
Hahahaha!

Aaron (51:49)
Yeah,

you didn't get the two day experience. I'm sure you had your fun.

Jamil Roberts (51:54)
Yeah, like

Dom Okus (51:54)
Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (51:57)
where was my exhibition game to lift the trophy?

Aaron (52:00)
Yeah, it was like,

it ended up being like seven to five, goal celebrations were crazy. was just like, it was nonsense, but it was good thing. Yeah, it was good.

Jamil Roberts (52:07)
I bet that was so cool man, fucking hell. Well,

Dom Okus (52:08)
Sh-

Jamil Roberts (52:14)
wow, we've we've, well, that, I think it would be hard to top it, but I guess we're gonna find out, because, it's about that time in the show where I pass it over to Dom, and, he's gonna take you through our staple piece section, or segment, don't know what the terminology is.

of the Backstik podcast. So Aaron, my hand over to Dom, he's gonna take you through extra time.

Dom Okus (52:42)
Welcome, welcome, welcome. And welcome back for anyone who's already familiar with this section. I'm your host for the most. I'm on Instagram and the social medias. They're calling me Steve Harvey with a skin fade. And so what I do in this section is I take these guests through for quick fire questions. So welcome to Extra Time, Mr. Walker. The first question is.

Who is the best player you've played with?

Aaron (53:14)
my gosh.

Dom Okus (53:15)
Yep, we're

starting there, nice and hot.

You're gonna upset some people today, but it's alright. It's okay.

Aaron (53:26)
This tough. I want to say, you know, I'm going to say he's not someone that jumps out. Like he's not putting up a ton of stats, but this guy, when I was in Cincinnati was so freaking talented. Corbin bone. Not many. I don't know. Some people probably know the name played in the MLS for a bit played at Cincinnati played ended up at Louisville center mid.

but just so, so smart and so tidy. I believe he was drafted by Chicago, if I'm not mistaken. And it was the year, it's a story where I believe it was like the year, the year right after, like, I don't know if you remember Quattamoc Blanco, I think was his name. He was a legend at a Chicago fire. We're the, we're the 10 or something like that. He retires. Corbin gets drafted.

Jamil Roberts (54:21)
Mm-hmm.

Aaron (54:24)
pretty high. was a solid, solid college player. And they off, think they offered him the 10. And this was just the kind of guy that Corbin was. He was like, I'm not taking that. Like, he's just so like such a humble dude, but like one of the most sneaky, like, players, like he's so tidy, you can't ever get close to him. He's just like touch play, touch play, like he just, he's just a proper like,

He's so good, he's so thoughtful with everything he's doing. He's one of those guys that could think three or four passes ahead and he sees the game at such a high level. And like I said, he's not gonna jump out at you. He's not one of those strikers that scores a million goals, but this guy was, he was next level.

Dom Okus (55:09)
Sick. Sick, sick, sick. Big up him. Big up him. Right, the next question is, who is the best player you've played against?

Aaron (55:18)
That was pfff, oof. Let's see.

Probably that same year we played Valencia in a summer friendly really really cool experience. It was like we had like 30,000 fans come out since Cincinnati was just a different level. The fan base was crazy. It made no sense for USL, but we played. We played Valencia and a lot of players a lot of people probably know Parejo.

Dom Okus (55:36)
Wow.

Jamil Roberts (55:39)
you

Aaron (55:53)
think he's at, I don't know where he's at now. Eddie Perejo, center mid, just so, so clean. Like another guy that's jumping out. And there were a lot of good names on that team. Played, Negredo was up top, Zaza. Just so many good players, but he, like another guy you just couldn't get close to. He was unpressable. Anytime you got close to...

Dom Okus (55:53)
Mm-hmm.

Jamil Roberts (55:57)
Honey Parejoa.

Dom Okus (55:59)
Mm-hmm.

Jamil Roberts (56:05)
Tech. Yeah.

Dom Okus (56:20)
Well.

Aaron (56:22)
He's playing a one touch pass around the corner and you're in the spin cycle. You're running around and you're like, you're just doing rondo around us for fun. And I know it was just like, just taking the piss out of us. And we were just like, I need a neck brace. Like it was mad. That guy was, he's unreal.

Jamil Roberts (56:26)
You

Dom Okus (56:34)
you

Jamil Roberts (56:36)
No.

Dom Okus (56:43)
Yeah, baller, baller, top baller, top baller, top baller. Right, I've got another question for you and you're probably gonna really upset some people with this one. But if you can pick three past or present teammates for a night out, who would they be and why?

Aaron (57:01)
I'm gonna have to go through the Rolodex here.

Jamil Roberts (57:03)
Hahaha

Dom Okus (57:04)
Yes!

Aaron (57:09)
I'd say maybe Tyler Pollock from Greenville. Always a good time. Funny. Just goofball. Fun to have around. Who else?

Jamil Roberts (57:13)
Yeah.

Aaron (57:28)
So I played with You guys might know the name actually in when I my first ever contract in Iceland He was also kind of a player coach at the time, but he was a center mid and so we played alongside each other Nigel Nigel quasi does that ring?

Dom Okus (57:44)
Okay, yeah, yeah,

yeah. Of course. Played at Norwich and that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Jamil Roberts (57:45)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Aaron (57:47)
Big time. Big time. He played in the prim

time and he's your typical just English like just his banter was like here, man, like pranks like old school English, like just knew how to like be fun and funny. He was unbelievable. He's definitely in there. We think of who else we got. That's so tough.

Jamil Roberts (57:59)
You

Aaron (58:15)
I had two incredible roommates in Cincinnati as well that I'd probably have to, it'd be tough to pick between those two, but Jimmy McLaughlin and Harrison Delbridge, both hilarious human beings. Jimmy was just a wild card. I'll say Jimmy, just cause he never knew what he was gonna do. He was just always out in left field doing whatever and always entertaining.

Dom Okus (58:36)
Shit.

Aaron (58:46)
The guy knew the guy knew how to put on a show and it didn't take much for him to have to do that. So He was always a bit of a liability, but the best kind of liability Yeah

Jamil Roberts (58:52)
Hahaha

Dom Okus (58:56)
We love those. It's always good

to just have someone that at any moment they can just take the night out somewhere, somewhere wild and there's a great story that comes from it. yeah, we love her. We love and hate. Yeah.

Jamil Roberts (59:05)
Mm-hmm. so sometimes you got to take the game by the scruff of the neck

Aaron (59:06)
make something up you'd you'd you'd look over you'd end up and be that guy and

he would be it would be him you know you'd turn around for one second and then turn around and you see him up on a table not caring about the world just dancing on a table and you're like my god and then he falls off the table and Jimmy forgive me but but he's prime entertainer

Dom Okus (59:27)
Oof.

I

love it. I love it. love it. I love it. Right to wrap us up. What would you say is your biggest achievement on the pitch so far?

Aaron (59:49)
I think probably winning that title, I've asked that before and I've thought, is it? But I think so. I think winning the trophy because the first year, 2019, we made the final, Greenville, and we lost in the final. And we played arguably the best game we had played all year. had, mean...

We were not favored in that game. was North Texas who used to be in the league. It was like FC Dallas's second team and they were incredible. I mean, they had a lot of players that you see now like Ricardo Pepe was on that team. Well, it's Cervania, like all these guys now in the MLS and have moved on to Europe and stuff like that. And that team was unbelievable. And we went in there away from home and

played the best we've ever played. it was just so hard to swallow that we created so many chances, hit the post, and came away with nothing. And then we were able to get it, you know, and finally win it. And that just, it just felt so sweet and justified. So that's probably it.

Dom Okus (1:01:03)
Sick, sick, sick. No, respect, respect. It's always nice winning, you know? I think we've had that a few times in here, right? Like, winning the championship. Like, getting personal awards is nice, but winning the championship with your team, if grafted for all season, is always nice. But that wraps us up for extra time. And I'm gonna kick it back to Jam. He's gonna close us out.

Jamil Roberts (1:01:06)
you

Yeah, man, I love it. I love it. I love these extra times man this so I'll give you my favorite part of the show because I just I love seeing the guests squirm when you give them the night out question I Might I might say this on every single episode but like it is my favorite part because you just see them replaying so many different parts in their head

Dom Okus (1:01:31)
Yes,

Yeah.

Aaron (1:01:44)
Yeah.

You can see him dumping it down too, I'm sure, trying to be a little PG.

Jamil Roberts (1:01:50)
yeah, little bit more political. For anyone watching on the YouTube there, I was muted, but I choked on, I'm not, I know if you can see my eyes have been watering, I just choked on a massive gulp of water and I was literally half dead over here whilst you lot were talking about, you know, the trophy with green pills. So for any of the viewers, I am alright. Thanks, the lads didn't-

Dom Okus (1:01:51)
I don't know. I know.

I'm sorry.

I'm full.

Jamil Roberts (1:02:18)
Give two shits, but I'm alright.

Dom Okus (1:02:20)
I mean, I was trying to be discreet for you and I was thinking, you know, maybe when you

edit it, you would just have us two on the screen so you could do your thing. But you're drawing attention to it now. So, yeah, if you didn't notice, just go back about a minute and watch Jamil absolutely dying. He's choking his head off. He's got his head back here. Like, wow, I'm trying to do my thing. So...

Jamil Roberts (1:02:38)
Mate, honestly, I was like, my eyes were like

blood, my eyes were like bloodshot and everything mate, I'm thinking I'm gonna, I genuinely thought across my eyes, I'm gonna to text Dom here and be like, can you close us out?

Dom Okus (1:02:45)
Yeah.

Aaron (1:02:52)
Yeah.

Dom Okus (1:02:56)
class man, hell yes.

Aaron (1:02:58)
minutes.

Jamil Roberts (1:02:59)
Okay, but now I'm alive from kicking and I'm well and and that and I'm well enough to kind of to acknowledge that I've enjoyed this I've enjoyed this because for two reasons one it's been a fun episode, but two I feel like This is hit so many Sort of this is ticked so many boxes

Dom Okus (1:03:01)
Good.

Jamil Roberts (1:03:24)
that like initially I swear to God I like half the shit that we've spoken about wasn't even on the episode plan like I've had to like purposefully like check little things I wanted to but like this just this conversation took on a life of its own and I've really enjoyed it mate Aaron I really hope you have as well mate

Aaron (1:03:43)
Yeah, that was sick. You never know when you're going into these things, what you're going to be asked and what you're going to talk about. But when it kind of flows like that and when you can be real, like I said, it's cool. And it feels like genuine conversation, which I think is super important. It's not just like, hey, welcome to the podcast. It's not robot.

Jamil Roberts (1:04:03)
Not that you've

Dom Okus (1:04:04)
Yeah, it's not stiff.

Jamil Roberts (1:04:06)
ever done any of them or you know you know if you go

They're not anywhere in the usl space right?

Dom Okus (1:04:12)
Yeah, yeah.

Aaron (1:04:17)
Yeah, no, super polished. Yeah, no, that's the way to do it, man. Like even the questions at the end, know, like let's, you know, being real and as much as you can be, but no, it was, I really enjoyed it. It good conversation.

Dom Okus (1:04:19)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So yeah, we enjoyed it too, man. That was sick. That was a good one.

Jamil Roberts (1:04:36)
Yeah, and listen We hope you did as well, and I know Dom kind of ran over it at the beginning of the show But here's just another reminder. Okay. We're not going anywhere. The backstick pod is here. It's thriving. We're To to just over two months in now and you know, we're not going anywhere We're enjoying ourselves too much to stop so get on board like subscribe at the back stick pod on all the socials go

Subscribe like on YouTube you can watch and listen to every single previous episode of the backstay podcast if you're new here on Apple Spotify as I said YouTube Google Amazon wherever you get your pods with that so As I said get on board and you know let's do this together But anyway once again from myself and Dom Aaron. Thanks ever so much for coming on the show, mate

And then to all of you guys I've given you the tools go out there and use them, but until until then from myself from Dom and from Aaron Thanks ever so much for listening, and we'll see you next time

Dom Okus (1:05:52)
Ace.

Aaron (1:05:53)
Cheers.